does 100 BULLETS count? If so, that goes on my list.

Lordjulius:

I understand your reluctance to isolate portions of Sandman. However, part of why I wanted to put this thread up was to recommend specific single-read stories to readers who may not have branched out into areas like this. Something like Sandman, with a ten-volume investment, can be daunting to many readers. Especially with the big "You must read from issue 1" attitude behind it.
Several stories in Sandman can be read independantly without losing anything. Season of Mists, Brief Lives, and The Kindly Ones all jump to mind. Yes, there is a larger, over-arching plot that connects the ten volumes on a grand scale, but that doesn't diminish the reading experience of individual reads. Additionally, I think there's something to be said for reccomending a specific portion. For instance, I would personally consider Season of Mists to be a much stronger story than A Game of You. Tossing out the specific name of a single story for recommendations would be, in my mind, more productive than letting someone fly blind.

Well, I'm sorry, but I disagree. Strongly. Especially about "The Kindly Ones." That really is like telling someone, "Well, if you don't want to read the whole 'Lord of the Rings' because it's so long, why don't you just pick up 'The Return of the King' (and, to complete the analogy, stop after Aragorn's marriage, leaving out the return to the Shire)."

Do you pick up a mystery novel and read the last chapter first?

If you are considering buying and reading the whole thing and you want to know where to start, and wonder if you have to start with "Preludes and Nocturnes" or can you start elsewhere, well, I think "A Doll's House" stands fairly well on its own. "Dream Country" stands alone just fine, and is probably the best "dip your toes in the water" intro for those unsure about the whole endeavor -- but ironically doesn't fit my definition of "graphic novel," since it's unrelated short stories. Another possible for folks like that I didn't even think to mention is the first Death mini -- "Death: The High Cost of Living." It doesn't introduce any of the major characters except Dream's sister, but it's a good introduction into the way things work int he Sandman universe and Neil's writing style. The second one is fairly dependent on having read "A Game of You" to really enjoy, I think.

Those aren't necessarily the best books -- "Preludes and Nocturnes" is in fact the closest thing to a weak one in the series -- but they're the only ones that don't depend on having read the others for a large part of your likely enjoyment and appreciation of them. Might you appreciate and enjoy them without it? Sure. Would you undoubtedly enjoy them more reading them the first time in their proper sequence? Indubitably.

So if you want to read "Sandman," and you want to know where to start, I'd say, one of those four.

If you have no interest in reading the whole thing and want to know which book is "best" because you just want to read that one, well, I'm sorry, that's just nonsense. You might as well say, "Well, the Godfather is a famous movie, but I can't watch more than a half hour of something, so which half hour should I watch?"

Am I exaggerating? Probably. Because it was written as a serial and Neil had to be aware that each month there might be new readers picking up the magazine for the first time. So picking up "The Kindly Ones" is not, in fact, quite as ridiculous as starting "The Godfather" on tape or DVD at the beginning of the baptism scene. But almost. And the first shiver that runs up your spine when you see the end coming will be much, much less effective because you haven't come to know and care about this character as much as you would have if you'd read them all from the beginning.

Anyway, what'd you think of the rest of my list?

No, of course not. But you're working under the assumption that the end of Kindly Ones is anything one can't see coming very, very early in the series.



Or perhaps, "I've never seen the Godfather, should I not watch Godfather II?"

Or, more to the point, "Can I just skip Godfather III altogether?"

A better example might be Shakespeare's history plays. From Richard II through (at least) Henry V are one story... namely the story of Prince Hal growing up into King Henry. However, if one reads Henry V first, the knowledge of Falstaff's death does not diminish the reading of Henry IV i & ii. In many ways, it can actually enhance it.

Let me put this another way. My girlfriend recently read Jaka's Story and loved it. If she were to now go back and read Cerebus, High Society, and Church & State, would her enjoyment of those volumes be ruined? Sim constantly refers to Cerebus as one long novel, but acknowledges that nothing is lost by reading individual volumes as stand-alone stories. Sure, a few key plot elements are referred to during Jaka's Story, especially ones related to the end of Church & State. But as far as I'm concerned, it's not the what, it's the how.

At the opening of Romeo & Juliet, you are told that they are going to die. Are the spine chills of the death scene ruined as a result?

Now this idea doesn't work across the board for all stories. Several writers build their tales around the what, and I see nothing wrong with that. Sandman, in my opinion, is built around the how.



Great list. There's a few things I haven't read on it that I'll have to pick up. (Ethel and Ernest is one I've been meaning to hit for a while.)

A couple additions to mine while we're at it:

Abe: Wrong For All the Right Reasons
by Glenn Dakin

Doing the Islands With Bacchus
by Eddie Campbell

There are many more, but either I'm blanking or others have already mentioned them. When my comics are unpacked from many boxes I'll add more...

EEEEEeeeewwwww!!!!!! What'd ya think of my list?!? Tell me, tell me tell me!!!

My girlfriend, who's never read any comix before, is currently enjoying Ghost World and Why I Hate Saturn. Nice introductory books.

I'm going to get her into Road to Perdition later, as well as moving into Sandman.

If you were making fun of me, up yours.

If you want to know what we think of your list, the only thing on it that I'd really call a "graphic novel" was also on mine. Expo is always a great anthology, and if we get away from my hangup on what a "graphic novel" is and just go for recommendations of "real books with comics in them" (as opposed to so-called "comic books," which of course aren't books at all), I'd heartedly second the Expo collection.

I'm not a big fan of Clowes, so I didn't pick up the latest Eightball, but if it's not going to be collected maybe I should have. A long time ago I picked up "Like a Velvet Glove Cast In Iron" or whatever it's called and my reaction was basically, "What's all the fuss? Why is this guy supposed to be a genius?" I had the same reaction to the first and only "Acme Novelty Library" I picked up -- although once I read the Jimmy Corrigan story as a collection I thought it was great. Still don't like Quimby, though.

On the other hand, I liked the movie "Ghost World," and read that after seeing the movie, and liked it. It was much better than his earlier work, and I'm probably going to give "David Boring" a try. I should have put "Ghost World" on the list, and once I read "David Boring" I might put it on there, too.

Some other people besides Clowes I realize I left off: Terry Moore (Strangers in Paradise), Peter Millidge (Strangehaven) and most especially James Sturm. "The Golem's Mighty Swing" is a wondeful book, which has me out searching for everything else he's done.

And Mvoid, well, I guess we'll have to agree to disagree. Shakespeare didn't write his plays serially as part of a larger whole (Indeed, his first history play was Henry VI). I already said "Cerebus" was an exception because of its extraordinary length, but even so I wouldn't suggest starting with anything past "Melmoth" -- which is the end of the first half. Even though "Guys" was supposed to be a good jumping-on point, I don't see it that way.

And it's not so much that reading "The Kindly Ones" gives away the ending as the impact of that book itself is lessened if one hasn't travelled with Morpheus down the long road that gets him there.

And you'd be surprised about the inevitability factor: I know at least two intelligent people who not only didn't see it coming before that book started, they were blown away by it when it happened. I though it was pretty clear fairly early on in that book, if not by the end of "Brief Lives," where we were going back when the comic was coming out monthly and we knew it was going to have an ending. But apparently it wasn't obvious to everybody.

Since we're listing books over and over and over again without description, add...

Jimmy

and

berlin, even though I read the singles.

I can't wait to add Epileptic to the list after I read it next week.

Bob Fingerman's Minimum Wage, book one.

If you've ever been to NY, then you need to check out this book and bug out at how authentic it is. A lot of NYC artists take the city for granted and draw it pretty lifelessly; but Fingerman took the city to heart, and you can FEEL it. His portrayal is as real as Doucet's in her book, My New York Diary.

Good choice. I forgot all about Fingerman. I like both "Minimum Wage" books, and although "White Like She" is more standard genre fare, it ain't bad either.

And steel, we're listing over and over because it was supposed to be what we like. We all seem to have the same good taste!

As far as descriptions, I think it's a great idea, but I knew my post was already really long plus a lot of the books I mentioned should be at least vaguely familiar to most people interested in the topic. I'd be happy to provide descriptions of the more obscure ones if you like.