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#294806 - 12/07/02 03:55 AM Re: UPDATED: ROB LIEFELD ON ALIAS, JJ ABRAMS AND HOLLYWOOD
DerekWatson Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 08/05/01
Posts: 15
Loc: St. Albans
Okay, here's the rub...I'm a retailer who's been in the business for nearly 12 years so I've been thru the boom and bust years of the early 90's and am still (thankfully) around today.

I'd like to make one point...

When I, like many other retailers, sit down at the end of the month to compile my Diamond order I work to a budget. I look at what's coming out and make a judgement on what's going to sell and what isn't. These days I am rarely able to speculate on new product or unknown titles because what I do is run a business firstly and love the medium secondly -- that's the way it is!

In the past, titles such as Youngblood, Battle Chasers and Danger Girl were BIG sellers. I'd order loads and sell loads. That is, until they started to ship later and later...or not at all...

The obvious result of this was that I no longer made the same amounts of money on these (and many other) titles...customers became disillusioned with the creators and we retailers took the brunt of the criticism from them . Other titles became tarred with the same brush. The public lost faith in the industry, and moved on...

The "hidden" impact of tardy shipping is more interesting, though. As I said, I work to a budget. If I order 100 copies of, say, Youngblood I'll be using a part of my budget, so I won't be ordering an equivalent value of other titles.

So, if Youngblood doesn't ship I lose money. I lose customers. But, the most important thing is that OTHER creators/publishers lose out because I didn't order their product -- which probably would have shipped on time!

As a side issue, it's also interesting to note that most indy creators are required by Diamond to submit 3 COMPLETE issues of new title before they'll be solicited in Previews. It's a shame that the rules don't apply elsewhere.

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#294807 - 12/07/02 07:37 AM Re: UPDATED: ROB LIEFELD ON ALIAS, JJ ABRAMS AND HOLLYWOOD
siegwulf Offline
Member

Registered: 11/30/01
Posts: 161
Loc: Avon, France
oh boy ! always the same war ? People aren't fed up apparently.

Well, about the Bloodsport mini-series I think he said things about it in this artcile. If you read instead of bash all the time you could have noticed he apologized for his lateness, he took it under his shoulders and responsability. This will come out in some weeks (4-5 apparently according to M. Millar), so for january now.

Now, he's working on Alias, producing and doing some back-up stories, he told he's too busy (with hollywood especially) doing himself a regular work, which is sad for fans like me, but at least it's a good reaction.
The man changed since years. He's more mature, and he's a father of two kids now, this changed your life. wink
Fact is people don't want to see he's changed because : "it's liefeld !! oh dear god !!!". This reaction isn't really mature. Give him some peace, let him what he wants, he hurts nobody. He produces and draws his own comics, who does it hurt ? nobody ! His fans are happy and his non-fans too no ? So pelase, give him some rest and let him do what he likes.

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#294808 - 12/07/02 10:47 AM Re: UPDATED: ROB LIEFELD ON ALIAS, JJ ABRAMS AND HOLLYWOOD
DaveCummings Offline
Member

Registered: 01/03/02
Posts: 163
Loc: Indianapolis, Indiana
Quote:
Originally posted by stevezundy:
I find it funny that before people were saying that "bashers" of Liefeld will buy the book.Now some one said the "bashers" won't buy the book so stop bashing him.

This was suppose to come out in October.Liefeld said that variant covers do not hurt.I think that fade has weared off in comics.Is Youngblood the only comic that was suppose to come out in October and didn't?No Ghost in the Shell 2 was and didn't come out as well.


I know Liefeld has said the industry is in bad shape(and it is) ,but did he ever think it was the factors of creatures that are late, never come out with the product, come out with a very bad product,variant covers, or the increasing cover price of comics.


Well, Steve, according to Studio Proteus, who is responsible for the translation and such for GITS 2, the release of the the first issue was result of the book having some really horrible printings. It printed really bad and they felt it was irresponsible of them to actually release the book in that condition. This causes 2 to ship late but, according to them 3 will be when it meets the schedule again.

This news is available at www.studioproteus.com .

~Dave

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#294809 - 12/07/02 11:45 AM Re: UPDATED: ROB LIEFELD ON ALIAS, JJ ABRAMS AND HOLLYWOOD
steel: A Long Departed Hero Offline
Member

Registered: 08/29/01
Posts: 4328
Loc: The MBA (Mysterious Blue Area)...
Quote:
Originally posted by DerekWatson:
Okay, here's the rub...I'm a retailer who's been in the business for nearly 12 years so I've been thru the boom and bust years of the early 90's and am still (thankfully) around today.

I'd like to make one point...

When I, like many other retailers, sit down at the end of the month to compile my Diamond order I work to a budget. I look at what's coming out and make a judgement on what's going to sell and what isn't. These days I am rarely able to speculate on new product or unknown titles because what I do is run a business firstly and love the medium secondly -- that's the way it is!

In the past, titles such as Youngblood, Battle Chasers and Danger Girl were BIG sellers. I'd order loads and sell loads. That is, until they started to ship later and later...or not at all...

The obvious result of this was that I no longer made the same amounts of money on these (and many other) titles...customers became disillusioned with the creators and we retailers took the brunt of the criticism from them . Other titles became tarred with the same brush. The public lost faith in the industry, and moved on...

The "hidden" impact of tardy shipping is more interesting, though. As I said, I work to a budget. If I order 100 copies of, say, Youngblood I'll be using a part of my budget, so I won't be ordering an equivalent value of other titles.

So, if Youngblood doesn't ship I lose money. I lose customers. But, the most important thing is that OTHER creators/publishers lose out because I didn't order their product -- which probably would have shipped on time!

As a side issue, it's also interesting to note that most indy creators are required by Diamond to submit 3 COMPLETE issues of new title before they'll be solicited in Previews. It's a shame that the rules don't apply elsewhere.


I understand all this. It's a shame. I was asking why people like me that just ordered it at the store because it looked cool would get so mad and be so derogatory toward Liefeld because his book is a couple monthes late. They really don't lose a thing. They have nothing invested. If it doesn't come out, it doesn't come out. I'm sure it will eventually, just be patient. You should have things in real life that take priority over this comic. This comic is just a bonus to you, without Liefeld it wouldn't be happening at all. It'll kick ass when it comes out and it will come out when it's ready and probably be a bigger hit. I just really don't understand all this anger over late indy books.
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#294810 - 12/07/02 01:50 PM Re: UPDATED: ROB LIEFELD ON ALIAS, JJ ABRAMS AND HOLLYWOOD
ctsmith83 Offline
Member

Registered: 07/06/01
Posts: 248
Loc: Canada
Quote:
Originally posted by steel: A New Hope:
I just really don't understand all this anger over late indy books.


Liefeld's productions are not really Indie books, per se. The anger towards Rob is due to the fact that he has historically failed to meet his shipping dates and yet continues to solicit products. He seems to have some sort of excuse (which is sometimes valid) to explain the lateness, or he says nothing at all and his fans are left waiting... Forever. He also has a nasty habit of starting projects and then never finishing them. That is why people get frustrated with him. He is the poster boy for all of those artists who can't meet a deadline, no matter what. Here's a simple rule: don't solicit the work until it's done. Either that or wait until it's at least 2/3 done.

With regards to Youngblood: Bloodsport, my prediction is that issue #1 will appear no earlier than February, issue #2 might be out in time for the next San Diego con (July) and issue #3 and/or others will never see print. And does anybody really believe that he's redrawing stuff because he wants to do justice to the script? Riiiiiiiiiight...

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#294811 - 12/07/02 02:53 PM Re: UPDATED: ROB LIEFELD ON ALIAS, JJ ABRAMS AND HOLLYWOOD
Studio D Comics Offline
Member

Registered: 10/30/02
Posts: 80
Loc: Canada
When I clicked on this article, the info I wanted most was where is the new YB comic. Glad I got that update.

I'm willing to give new creators a fair shake with their schedules. To me, if you're a creator who's put out a late book, but it's your first time self/indy publishing, then sure, it's understandable.

But Rob has a 10 year history of soliciting books that are either way late/never come out. As so many people have already mentioned. More than any other single creator that I can think of. More than Jim Lee, Silvestri, McFarlane, anyone.

But I'm waiting for this new YB comic, when/if it comes out I will buy it, because I'm so curious about it. As long as it's resonably priced for an indy title, NOT a holo-foil cover or bagged and $8.00 an issue or something. As Rob says, if you don't like the variant covers don't buy them. I intend not to, as I personally dislike that marketing scheme. I intend to just pick the best looking cover (if I have a choice)

Still, all this is dependent on YB even coming out.


later
don
_________________________
studioDcomics.com

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#294812 - 12/07/02 05:24 PM Re: UPDATED: ROB LIEFELD ON ALIAS, JJ ABRAMS AND HOLLYWOOD
stlfan79 Offline
Member

Registered: 05/07/02
Posts: 961
Loc: collegeville central
Good luck Rob, Im still looking forward to Bloodsport.
_________________________
Favorite Comics 12/13/05
1 Daredevil
2 Ultimates
3 Rex Mundi
4 Walking Dead
5 Invincible
6 Majestic
7 Punisher
8 Goon
9 Fables
10 Y
11 Shaolin Cowboy
12 Fell
13 Desolation Jones
14 Doc Frankenstein
15 Ex Machina
If Hellboy was monthly it would be #1

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#294813 - 12/07/02 06:36 PM Re: UPDATED: ROB LIEFELD ON ALIAS, JJ ABRAMS AND HOLLYWOOD
Bad P Rockin Offline
Member

Registered: 02/09/02
Posts: 66
Loc: Orlando
Quote:
LIEFELD: Well. SHRINK! is being written as we speak. Sony hired two outstanding writers named Requa and Ficarra who wrote CATS AND DOGS and Terry Swigoff's (who did CRUMB and GHOST WORLD) new film, BAD SANTA starring Billy Bob Thornton as the most twisted department store Santa you could ever imagine. They're also writing a draft of Ridley Scott's next film while completing SHRINK! We had a great meeting with Jennifer Lopez, who's also producing the movie, a few weeks back and she had great suggestions and insight. Anyone who thinks she's not incredibly intelligent savvy and driven are making a big mistake. She blew everyone away with some really great material for her character and the writers implemented it immediately. We should have a finished draft by January and evaluate it from there. The SHRINK! comics on the web will soon be returning on Jennifer's web site, so I've been working on several new strips as well as talking to some other writers and artists about contributing strips as well.




I'm surprised this is moving forward because Rob is a man of great moral character and J-Ho had herself locked in a room with him...

She might have wanted to see his pencil...

But I guess she settled for having someone call her intelligent in public.
_________________________
Geeky is as Geeky does.

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#294814 - 12/08/02 11:05 PM Re: UPDATED: ROB LIEFELD ON ALIAS, JJ ABRAMS AND HOLLYWOOD
blind3rdeye Offline
Member

Registered: 07/31/02
Posts: 71
Loc: Queensland Australia
Easy maths
Liefeld = crap

Class dismissed
_________________________
If at first you don't succeed, skydiving is not for you.

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#294815 - 12/09/02 12:14 AM Re: UPDATED: ROB LIEFELD ON ALIAS, JJ ABRAMS AND HOLLYWOOD
stevezundy Offline
Member

Registered: 12/20/01
Posts: 630
Thanks Dave for the update on Ghost in the Shell 2.

For people that say whom does the late books hurt, it may hurt retailers.When or if it comes out costumers may see it and because it is late may pass.Some costumers change their minds that easily.

Does anyone know what date the first issue of Youngblood's came out?

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