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#458071 - 01/11/01 03:57 AM CHAYKIN TAKING OVER CABLE? WEINBERG EXITS
Anonymous
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You just canít get away from the X-Men these days. Just as soon as a Wednesday press conference seemingly called an end to several weeks of rumor and speculation regarding the core titles, and future creative make-up of another title - Cable - is in flux.

After a series of message board posts the past few days by series writer Robert Weinberg calling his role in the future of the title in question, Thursday morning the writer/author clarified whatís happening in a press release...

Full story at http://www.fandom.com/comics

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#458072 - 01/11/01 12:12 PM Re: CHAYKIN TAKING OVER CABLE? WEINBERG EXITS
C Keller Offline
Member

Registered: 09/16/00
Posts: 163
Loc: Same Place as Before
If the report of Chaykin's involvement is accurate, and I have no reason to doubt that it is, I'm somewhat disappointed.

I think that Chaykin is one of the better comic writers working in the field and I enjoy most of his (these days) limited output. I'm extremely pleased that he'll be doing a monthly book at Vertigo and it's one of very few new mainstream books that I'm willing to pre-order.

I don't think that his best work is done while working on other writer's concepts or characters and I don't think that superheroes fit well with his style or sensibilities. If the man is returning to his comic book roots, probably due to the upcoming writers strike in the TV and film industries, I'd much rather see him playing with more complex concepts than Cable inherently offers.

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#458073 - 01/11/01 06:41 PM Re: CHAYKIN TAKING OVER CABLE? WEINBERG EXITS
MacrossJXS Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 01/09/01
Posts: 11
Loc: San Francisco, CA. USA
"I don't think that superheroes fit well with his style or sensibilities."
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Hmmm...I never thought Chaykin was a bad fit for 'superheroes', I just always thought his characters, superheroic or not had a lot of personality on a more adult level.


"I'd much rather see him playing with more complex concepts than Cable inherently offers.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
I couldn't disagree more. I think Cable offers quite a lot of complexity in the character and his concept. He's a time traveler, was kidnapped and raised by an obsessive cult of zealot nuns, persecuted by a twin brother, he's an organic cyborg who is older than his parents, and he survived a nearly fatal virus. I think Cable is one of the more interestly, understandable and complax characters in Marvel's stable.

my .002

-Josh

[This message has been edited by MacrossJXS (edited 01-11-2001).]

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#458074 - 01/11/01 06:58 PM Re: CHAYKIN TAKING OVER CABLE? WEINBERG EXITS
C Keller Offline
Member

Registered: 09/16/00
Posts: 163
Loc: Same Place as Before
I wish him all the best of luck with this book, but I still don't see it as working towards his strengths. Specifically, I think Chaykin works best when he's dealing with real world characters that are confronted with grey areas of morality, day to day emotionally grinding problems and political imbroglios.

I've enjoyed his work on Twilight and that Son of Superman thing he did, but felt that he was more fun to read when he worked on American Flagg, Power & Glory, or Black Kiss.


No matter how good a creation Cable might be (I haven't read it, so I'm not in a position to make a judgement about it), Chaykin wasn't in a position to design the character from top to bottom. The character won't have the multi-hued shades of Chaykin morality built in, and so won't be as much of a blank slate as Chaykin is used to.

Regardless, I hope the book sells well and that all it's readers are pleased with Chaykin's work on it. Despite my lack of affinity for Marvel and all things X, I'll probably give at least the first couple of issues a shot.

Congratulations to everyone pleased by the news.

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#458075 - 01/12/01 02:00 PM Re: CHAYKIN TAKING OVER CABLE? WEINBERG EXITS
MacrossJXS Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 01/09/01
Posts: 11
Loc: San Francisco, CA. USA
Quote:
Originally posted by C Keller:
Specifically, I think Chaykin works best when he's dealing with real world characters that are confronted with grey areas of morality, day to day emotionally grinding problems and political imbroglios.


I agree with that, and I'm not sure that Weinberg didn't bring any of that complexity to the character in his time writing the title. Cable has shown in the past, especially when Nicieza was his main writer, of being in that gray area of morality. Cable has never been an altruistic heroic character. He's been a guy willing to sacrifice important things such as values or people when it fit a circumstance that he felt it was a warranted sacrifice.

Letting your own sie die because it was in the better interests of winning a battle is a decision made by fairly 'gray-area'd morality' character, I would think (hope?).

Quote:
Originally posted by C Keller:
I've enjoyed his work on Twilight and that Son of Superman thing he did, but felt that he was more fun to read when he worked on American Flagg, Power & Glory, or Black Kiss.

I really enjoyed Black Kiss, I'm not too familiar with the story of American Flagg, but I always liked the art on it. Power and Glory I liked for the drawing and political intrigue, but overall I thought it was a 7 on a 10 scale. I liked his Scorpio graphic Novel as well.

Cable does not really bring much in terms of a political nature in the sense of governmental politics, but I think Chaykin can bring up Cable's political ploys and style in terms of the X-universe where Professor X and Magneto have traditionally been the inside political leaders.

If Cable had certain interests in mind I can see him backstabbbing the professor in order to build a conses of X-men who agreed with his thinking or positions. He already did that once with X-Force, but that was an easier thing since they were kids.

Quote:
Originally posted by C Keller:
Chaykin wasn't in a position to design the character from top to bottom. The character won't have the multi-hued shades of Chaykin morality built in, and so won't be as much of a blank slate as Chaykin is used to.

I see that point, there are Chaykinesque things that can't be played out with Cable, probably no religous themes in the Judeo-Christian sense, as Cable's theology is wrapped around the Askani. I think some of the sexuality can be played especially in terms of Domino and the clone of Domino (name escapes now). Plus Howard, IMO, has always had a nice penchant for spy material and Cable is right in that mix.

He used to run a merc/ spy-op unit called the Six Pack. G.W. Bridge, a high ranking Shield agent was a member of that group, so Cable has some inside influence at Shield. And Cable has ties to the weapon x program due to his association with Garrison Kane (current Weapon X) and DeadPool.

Quote:
Originally posted by C Keller:
Regardless, I hope the book sells well and that all it's readers are pleased with Chaykin's work on it.

I hope Chaykin's work is good so that I'll become a reader. I have not read Cable regularly since Steve Skroce departed the book a few years back.

[This message has been edited by MacrossJXS (edited 01-12-2001).]

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#458076 - 01/12/01 02:15 PM Re: CHAYKIN TAKING OVER CABLE? WEINBERG EXITS
James Collins Offline
Member

Registered: 01/12/01
Posts: 81
Loc: Toledo,OH
Chaykin taking over Cable is not going to make a differance in sales. I'm NOT going to order more copies than I am now. Marvel is a VERY DESPERATE company these days. The proof is in the fact, THEY'RE NOT CONFIDENT IN THEIR OWN PRODUCT, THEY WOULD RATHER TRY TO MAKE THE RETAILER TAKE ALL THE RISK WITH THEIR "BS" PRINT TO ORDER COLLECTABILITY CRAP!! [Have they learned NOTHING from 6-7 years ago? NOT ENOUGH SHOPS OUT OF BUSINESS FOR THEM?] If something sells well and I NEED MORE copies, Marvel Damn well better have more available or IT'S LOST SALES FOR ALL OF US!! MAYBE SOMEONE AT MARVEL SHOULD SPEND A DAYS AT FEW SHOPS, THEY MAY LEARN SOMETHING!

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#458077 - 01/12/01 02:53 PM Re: CHAYKIN TAKING OVER CABLE? WEINBERG EXITS
RavenProject Offline
Member

Registered: 02/08/00
Posts: 84
Loc: Carol Stream, IL USA
>>>THEY'RE NOT CONFIDENT IN THEIR OWN PRODUCT, THEY WOULD RATHER TRY TO MAKE THE RETAILER TAKE ALL THE RISK WITH THEIR "BS" PRINT TO ORDER COLLECTABILITY CRAP!!<<<

Y'know, the more I read that, the more I think that the presented reason is far different from the real reason.

When Marvel overprints, two primary costs are incurred. 1) Printing fees -- especially if the overprinting isn't enough to reach a better per-unit price point. 2) Warehousing fees - because they can't just shove those comics into the Negative Zone while they wait for reorders.

Now those costs may balance out if Marvel does manage to sell the comics in question, but if they don't then they're left with a loss... and an ongoing cost on the warehoused comics.

So the question becomes: Can Marvel sell enough of the overprints to justify the costs incurred? Seems like the answer is no, so they dropped the plan.

Now, had Marvel come to the retailers and presented things that way, it would have been honest but also would have been a devastating admission about Marvel's current state. So instead, they looked for something -- *anything* -- they could say to retailers to warn them of the situation and give them fair opportunity to adjust their plans accordingly, but still keeping a positive face on the issue.

Unfortunately, they botched it. The way Jemas presented things, it does look like a ploy to restore the problems of the mid-nineties by making retailers increase their orders on anticipated "collectibles."

Well, sort of, because people seem to ignore the other things Marvel announced. For example, if a comic sells out to the DM, they will act quickly to make that issue available to readers -- by reprinting online, and by releasing a trade collection as quickly as possible. For example, the Ultimate Spider-Man #1-#3 reprint came out at the same time as #4, at a really good price point, and the TPB of #1-#7 will be out shortly after #7 prints.

So, if the objection comes from the fact that you can't get comic *readers* the *stories* they want, then that's not entirely correct -- you'll have it again in a fairly prompt method.

That said... I still think overprinting has its place. The first issues of Ultimate Spider-Man and Ultimate X-Men, for example, should have a big overprint... but #6 and on shouldn't. By then, the market should have established itself pretty well and retailers should be able to order accurately.

-J

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