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#501085 - 10/12/02 09:04 AM
Re: What, no weeping for the WEF?
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Member
Registered: 05/18/01
Posts: 3080
Loc: North Kackalackee
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Originally posted by Michael D.: A militia which we haven't really needed since the day after the Revolutionary War ended.  And as soon as we let the right to have it be taken away, that's when we'll need it the most.
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#501086 - 10/12/02 09:31 AM
Re: What, no weeping for the WEF?
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Member
Registered: 03/25/00
Posts: 240
Loc: London, England
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Originally posted by Eel O'Brian:
And as soon as we let the right to have it be taken away, that's when we'll need it the most. Just to say, you lose the guns and you'll probably be over-run by Eurotrash former WEF people. I'm not interested in the guns debate per se, but you know the worst comic thread I ever read (and I mean read because it was compulsive) was one about guns in a JLA/JSA crossover in Usenet. Which brings me to the thought that the over-all syntax might be different (Comicon is to scatology as the WEF is to superiority complex ?) but the content is the same. Comics discussion > arguments over genre or format > US vs Them> U.S. vs The Rest of the World > Guns or "Freedom of Speech" What ever. We let our Royals have guns and look where it got us.
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#501087 - 10/12/02 09:47 AM
Re: What, no weeping for the WEF?
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Member
Registered: 05/18/01
Posts: 3080
Loc: North Kackalackee
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Originally posted by Adrian Brown:
Just to say, you lose the guns and you'll probably be over-run by Eurotrash former WEF people. Um, no. I mean we'll (the US) probably easily slip into a Police State with no means of stopping it. And, Rich Johnston - You want to know what happens when you try to stop governmental tyranny without weapons of your own? Ask anyone who was around Tiananmen Square in 1989. Here's one account: “...at one command, the soldiers raised their guns and fired one round at the residents and students, who fell to the ground. As soon as the gunshots stopped, other people rushed forward to rescue the wounded. The steps of a clinic near Xidan were already covered in blood. But the struggle at the intersection did not stop. Armoured vehicles ran over roadblocks, knocked over cars and buses. The unarmed people had only bricks... What they got in return was bullets... People dispersed and ran for their lives. Soldiers ran after them, guns blazing. Even when residents ran into courtyards or into the shrubbery, the soldiers would catch up with them and kill them”. - Beijing's Unforgettable Spring, Liu Binyan and Xu Gang, describing events at the Xidan intersection, 2 km west of Tiananmen Square, pp. 59-60
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#501088 - 10/12/02 01:40 PM
Re: What, no weeping for the WEF?
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Member
Registered: 04/18/99
Posts: 1465
Loc: New York, New York
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I can't believe all you kids are arguing about Rich's "Guns don't stop government tyranny, people do" line when it is just a parody of the gun lobby's favorite mantra "Guns don't kill, people do."
If one is true, so is the other.
And Eel, we've had many runs in, follwoed by a sort of mutual respect. I certainly don't think yuo are stupid by any means, and I know people like to hold on to their guns. but let me ask you this, in all seriousness.
Do you think that being able to buy a a semi-automatic weapon at Wal-Mart -- a gun which is not used in hunting, is not meant for personal self defense, but is meant for mass killing and assult -- makes this country safer?
_________________________
Oh boy, sleep! That's where I'm a viking!
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#501089 - 10/12/02 01:41 PM
Re: What, no weeping for the WEF?
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Member
Registered: 06/23/01
Posts: 708
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Originally posted by Michael D.:
A militia which we haven't really needed since the day after the Revolutionary War ended. Riiiiight.
Overview of Changes to Legal Rights
By The Associated Press
September 5, 2002, 11:44 AM EDT
Some of the fundamental changes to Americans' legal rights by the Bush
administration and the USA Patriot Act following the terror attacks:
-FREEDOM OF ASSOCIATION: Government may monitor religious and political
institutions without suspecting criminal activity to assist terror investigation.
-FREEDOM OF INFORMATION: Government has closed once-public immigration hearings,
has secretly detained hundreds of people without charges, and has encouraged
bureaucrats to resist public records requests.
-FREEDOM OF SPEECH: Government may prosecute librarians or keepers of any other
records if they tell anyone that the government subpoenaed information related
to a terror investigation.
-RIGHT TO LEGAL REPRESENTATION: Government may monitor federal prison jailhouse
conversations between attorneys and clients, and deny lawyers to Americans
accused of crimes.
-FREEDOM FROM UNREASONABLE SEARCHES: Government may search and seize Americans'
papers and effects without probable cause to assist terror investigation.
-RIGHT TO A SPEEDY AND PUBLIC TRIAL: Government may jail Americans indefinitely
without a trial.
-RIGHT TO LIBERTY: Americans may be jailed without being charged or being able
to confront witnesses against them.
Copyright © 2002, The Associated Press
_________________________
"At no time in these 110 something messages have I said Newsarama.com isn't entirely based on the subjective judgment of Matt and myself." Michael Doran
"Don't EVER hotlink an image from SomethingAwful.com if you don't want to get banned for posting porn." - ComicReader
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#501090 - 10/12/02 01:44 PM
Re: What, no weeping for the WEF?
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Member
Registered: 06/23/01
Posts: 708
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Originally posted by Heidi MacDonald:
Do you think that being able to buy a a semi-automatic weapon at Wal-Mart -- a gun which is not used in hunting, is not meant for personal self defense, but is meant for mass killing and assult -- makes this country safer? I don't know about him, but I sure as hell do. What I think makes us less safe, is the fact that you can't buy uncensored music at that very same Wal-Mart...
_________________________
"At no time in these 110 something messages have I said Newsarama.com isn't entirely based on the subjective judgment of Matt and myself." Michael Doran
"Don't EVER hotlink an image from SomethingAwful.com if you don't want to get banned for posting porn." - ComicReader
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#501091 - 10/12/02 01:49 PM
Re: What, no weeping for the WEF?
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Member
Registered: 04/16/02
Posts: 1349
Loc: CS, CO
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Originally posted by Heidi MacDonald:
Do you think that being able to buy a a semi-automatic weapon at Wal-Mart -- a gun which is not used in hunting, is not meant for personal self defense, but is meant for mass killing and assult -- makes this country safer? From what Ive read, Sweden is the safest country in the world because every household in the country has a gun. Everyone also serves in the military there so it could that they know how to use the guns in contrast to a lot of American gun owners who have no clue. Personally I think you should have to take a shooting test to see if you can have a gun. Sortve like a drivers license for guns. You get 3 out of 5 in the circle you get your permit, come back in 90 days and you get 5 out of 5 you get the real license.
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ianskylerbrown@yahoo.com
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#501092 - 10/12/02 01:54 PM
Re: What, no weeping for the WEF?
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Member
Registered: 05/18/01
Posts: 3080
Loc: North Kackalackee
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Originally posted by Heidi MacDonald:
Do you think that being able to buy a a semi-automatic weapon at Wal-Mart -- a gun which is not used in hunting, is not meant for personal self defense, but is meant for mass killing and assult -- makes this country safer? No, and I never said I did. It seems to me that Rich is arguing for the abolishment of the Second Amendment, and I completely disagree with that. Certainly there should be enforcement of laws already on the books, and certain limitations placed on the kinds of firearms an individual can possess - no one wants a bunch of Rambos running around with belt-fed machine guns. And why do you call these discussions 'run-ins'? I'm having a great time, personally. Just because we disagree on 90% of everything, that doesn't mean I don't like and respect you.
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#501093 - 10/12/02 02:12 PM
Re: What, no weeping for the WEF?
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Member
Registered: 04/18/99
Posts: 1465
Loc: New York, New York
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Originally posted by Eel O'Brian:
No, and I never said I did. It seems to me that Rich is arguing for the abolishment of the Second Amendment, and I completely disagree with that. Okay, thanks for the clarification. For what it's worth, I'm all for the Seceond Amendment, because a well regulated militia is certainly necessary to the security of a free state. The extremes of the radical gun lobby in the country are just that, however, extreme. If you stop and think abut the fact that Congress had to *debate* banning the sale of *assault weapons* in *department stores* and you see how far the madness has gotten. As for the Sweden thing... I think that it should be as hard to buy a gun as a car. you should need to prove that you are responsible. I've gone target shooting wih .22s, and believe me, I'm one person you wouldn't want with a gun in her hand to defend anyone. (Of course, nowadays they have those scopes that turn 8 year olds into Annie Oakley, so skill is not necessary.)
_________________________
Oh boy, sleep! That's where I'm a viking!
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#501094 - 10/12/02 03:30 PM
Re: What, no weeping for the WEF?
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Member
Registered: 06/23/01
Posts: 708
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Originally posted by kingtut:
Personally I think you should have to take a shooting test to see if you can have a gun. Sortve like a drivers license for guns. You get 3 out of 5 in the circle you get your permit, come back in 90 days and you get 5 out of 5 you get the real license. That's actually the most reasonable "gun control" suggestion I've read yet. Interesting...
_________________________
"At no time in these 110 something messages have I said Newsarama.com isn't entirely based on the subjective judgment of Matt and myself." Michael Doran
"Don't EVER hotlink an image from SomethingAwful.com if you don't want to get banned for posting porn." - ComicReader
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