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#520791 - 08/25/03 05:05 PM Re: My era has passed.
Norb Offline
Member

Registered: 07/18/01
Posts: 409
Loc: San Francisco, CA
Quote:
Originally posted by Claude:
Have you thought of investingating some of the non-DC/Marvel titles? "Cerebus" has less than a year to go, but has been utterly fascinating, "Love and Rockets" is routinely excellent, and there must be a zillion other small-press books begging for readers.

Next time you're at a convention, if you do indeed go, ask around for what's good among the alternative comics. The comics medium is still producing wonderful stuff.

--Claude


Agreed. I love superhero comics (some of them, anyway), but if that was all I read for 40 years, I'd be sick of comic books, too.

Recent comics I've really enjoyed include Persepolis, One Hundred Demons, Same Difference, Halo and Sprocket, Shuck, Finder, everything by Tony Millionaire... the list goes on and on. I'm also reading a lot of manga, especially Osamu Tezuka, and reprints of classic comic strips like Thimble Theater, Krazy Kat, and Alley Oop. It's a big medium.

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#520792 - 08/25/03 06:40 PM Re: My era has passed.
jeaoure Offline
Member

Registered: 03/14/02
Posts: 800
Loc: Long Beach, CA
"Dear CBG,

I'm writing to let you know that superheroes no longer prompt the massive boner they gave me as a kid. Since I've flushed all my money down the john on comics about spandex-clad buffoons, I've decided the medium as a whole has nothing more to offer. I've heard that there are comics out there with greater story depth and topic breadth than X-Men, but it's far easier to type out a dramatic farewell to the comics scene than to actually seek out some of these books.

So, au revoir, comics! You've just lost one drama queen and that is indeed a shame.

-Sam"

...

Seriously, dude, what did you expect? I usually try to avoid the onemoment-style snottiness, but why on earth would you continue on the Path to Crap when there are so many great comics out there?

Sam, I tell you this sincerely, as an adult comics-fan: the days of Stan and Jack, of Denny and Neal, of Marv and George are over and frankly, their work doesn't hold a candle to the quality of art and storytelling that's being produced today. Granted, they may have paved the way and broken down some very important walls for the medium... but we're living in the most exciting moments of comic-book history this very second. Finally, there's a market for the truly great stuff.

Bail out now if you like, but it'll be your loss.
_________________________
http://www.ObnoxiousBoners.com

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#520793 - 08/25/03 07:59 PM Re: My era has passed.
bousvaros Offline
Member

Registered: 05/31/01
Posts: 1145
Loc: Boston MA
Sam,

Even though some of your posts have rubbed me the wrong way in the past few months, I'm disappointed you are giving up on new comics. There ARE a few superhero titles out there you might enjoy, including:

Simonson and Ordway's recent run on Wonder WOman
Loeb and Lee's excellent Batman story
Bendis' Daredevil and Ultmate Spider-Man
the very wacky X-Statix
Matt Wagner's wonderful new Trinity series.

If you want to "stretch your legs" a little and try books out of the mainstream, I'd recommend Charles Burns work for Fantagraphics, and Louis Riel by Chester Brown. If you have kids, pick up Scooby Doo - the Joe Staton art is terrific.

Like me, you probably long for the halcyon days of Adams, Kirby, Colan, Wrightson and Buscema. Unfortunately, these days are long gone, and much of today's material emphasizes sensationalism over quality. Nevertheless, if long-standing hard core fans like you give up on the new stuff, the industry has no future. I hope you'll give some of the above books a try.

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#520794 - 08/25/03 08:21 PM Re: My era has passed.
Matthewwave Offline
Member

Registered: 06/04/00
Posts: 4993
Loc: Seattle, WA USA
Same Difference and Other Stories was really good.

As for Batman/Superman/Wonder Woman: Trinity, I thought that second issue was ugly and depressing as Hell. The first issue was a treat, however, and the art is tops, so I'll stick with it for the third and final issue.

Matthew

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#520795 - 08/25/03 08:35 PM Re: My era has passed.
David Porta Offline
Member

Registered: 06/15/03
Posts: 4823
Quote:
Originally posted by jeaoure:
The days of Stan and Jack, of Denny and Neal, of Marv and George are over and frankly, their work doesn't hold a candle to the quality of art and storytelling that's being produced today. Granted, they may have paved the way and broken down some very important walls for the medium... but we're living in the most exciting moments of comic-book history this very second. Finally, there's a market for the truly great stuff.


"Marv and George"? Don't you mean "Marv and Gene (Colan)"? Or "Marv and Mike (Ploog)"? Or is it another Marv? Marv who?

(Stan and) "Jack Kirby doesn't hold a candle to today's best work"? That is totally nuts. Somebody's out of his freakin' mind, to even think that. Kirby's brilliant 4th World metaphor of the counterculture and the Vietnam War pisses on anything Dave Sim ever wrote. Do you think alt comics cover romance with realism? Kirby not only *created* the genre, his best stories *still* stand head and shoulders above anything alt has or can produce -- because he had the real heart and soul of a mentsh, not some low-life degenerate.

Neal Adams "may have paved the way, but..."

"But"?

Boy, that guy has influenced comics with nudges here and there that really add up: helping launch the failed ACBA (Acadamey of Comic Book Arts) that gave out comicdom's academy awards for a year or two (the U.K. Eagle had better success), trying to introduce the phrase "continuity graphics" to supplant the culturally low-rent "comic books," making the Joker (visually, intentionally) gay in the early '70s, standing up for Stan Lee before fandom when Stan's populartity had taken a hit, championing creator rights more successfully than Frazetta ever did among the publishers, championing modified formats (indirectly, apparently -- the whole venture into producing more expensive comics, Dollar Comics, was inititated by Neal Adams when he found himself in a position of influence at DC by dating and flaternizing with the newly arrived publisher, Jenette Kahn; you didn't hear it from me), and on into the '80s with his participation in direct sales and his own company. What a guy!

~Dave

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#520796 - 08/25/03 08:56 PM Re: My era has passed.
Shoegaze99 Offline
Member

Registered: 06/15/02
Posts: 5325
Loc: Not Applicable, USA
Quote:
Originally posted by bousvaros:
disappointed you are giving up on new comics

You mean you took it seriously? I didn't. He's not giving up comics. Oh, maybe for a week or two. Maybe even for two whole months. But it's not over for him, and he knows it.
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#520797 - 08/25/03 09:06 PM Re: My era has passed.
jeaoure Offline
Member

Registered: 03/14/02
Posts: 800
Loc: Long Beach, CA
Well, it's your opinion and you're welcome to it. I'm not diminishing the contributions of Jack Kirby or Neal Adams by saying that there's better stuff being done today... Nothing wrong with New Gods, but it's difficult to imagine a serious comparison between that work and, say, Cages. And, really, did the innovations of the Neal Adams/Denny O'Neil Green Lantern/Green Arrow even begin to plumb the depths of Jimmy Corrigan?

And speaking of Neal, yeah, he did all manner of wonderful things (and he seems to be a pretty nice guy to boot), but are we really celebrating the creation of Continuity Comics? Don't get me wrong, he's got a lovely line... but I think the world has seen better stories than CyberRad and Bucky O'Hare.

By the way, "Marv and George" were Wolfman & Perez, respectively. Superstars of the eighties whose Teen Titans and Crisis were selling the pants off of virtually everything else at the moment.

And, by the way, there's a whole heckuva lot that pisses on anything Dave Sim ever wrote, so no big statements there.

I don't think I'll ever understand what's so controversial about saying "they had their day and it's done now. Others have taken what they started and gone on to build even more." Wouldn't they have wanted that? Isn't "Just Imagine Stan Lee Creating..." proof enough that the old stuff isn't really working anymore?

We disagree: nothing wrong with the old stuff, but these are more exciting times, more interesting times, and better times. We can cling to the stuff that can't seem to manage to bring back that ol' four-color feeling anymore, like Sam, or we can embrace the best of today, the best ever.
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http://www.ObnoxiousBoners.com

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#520798 - 08/25/03 09:20 PM Re: My era has passed.
Samuel Catalino Offline
Member

Registered: 04/04/99
Posts: 4447
Quote:
Originally posted by Shoegaze99:

You mean you took it seriously? I didn't. He's not giving up comics. Oh, maybe for a week or two. Maybe even for two whole months. But it's not over for him, and he knows it.


Actually, I have. I have purchased no new comics this month. Nor have I any intention to purchase any new comics in the future.

Anything I get from the comic store are things that I ordered several months ago.
_________________________
"If we lose a hundred troops a week, then Dean will be our next Prez." Jack V, avid Dean supporter with no concern for the troops.

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#520799 - 08/25/03 09:25 PM Re: My era has passed.
Samuel Catalino Offline
Member

Registered: 04/04/99
Posts: 4447
Quote:
Originally posted by bousvaros:
Sam,

Even though some of your posts have rubbed me the wrong way in the past few months, I'm disappointed you are giving up on new comics. There ARE a few superhero titles out there you might enjoy, including:

Simonson and Ordway's recent run on Wonder WOman
Loeb and Lee's excellent Batman story
Bendis' Daredevil and Ultmate Spider-Man
the very wacky X-Statix
Matt Wagner's wonderful new Trinity series.

If you want to "stretch your legs" a little and try books out of the mainstream, I'd recommend Charles Burns work for Fantagraphics, and Louis Riel by Chester Brown. If you have kids, pick up Scooby Doo - the Joe Staton art is terrific.

Like me, you probably long for the halcyon days of Adams, Kirby, Colan, Wrightson and Buscema. Unfortunately, these days are long gone, and much of today's material emphasizes sensationalism over quality. Nevertheless, if long-standing hard core fans like you give up on the new stuff, the industry has no future. I hope you'll give some of the above books a try.



I did mention only one of those superheroes title in my initial post, but I am sure that the others you mention are fine books.

It is just that I have lost interest in comics in general. There are a number of fellows my age that are giving up buying new books. Some have done so for a long period of time.

They have discovered other parts of the hobby to pursue, some have pursued original art, and others have pursued collecting arrow heads...believe it or not.

No one should take my opinion as completely dissing comics as they are these days. There are a lot of fine comics out there. It is just that I don't have any desire to purchase them.
_________________________
"If we lose a hundred troops a week, then Dean will be our next Prez." Jack V, avid Dean supporter with no concern for the troops.

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#520800 - 08/25/03 09:27 PM Re: My era has passed.
Scout99 Offline
Member

Registered: 05/22/01
Posts: 1223
Quote:
Originally posted by C.Kent:
Now, if only you could stop leaving Comic Message Boards.

Jeez, What do you want? Are we supposed to beg and scream for you to stick around?


Beat it and good riddance!



Hear, hear! I always knew Sam was a phony!

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