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#525238 - 10/30/03 09:04 AM Re: Nutty laws in Vermont....?
Dean R Milburn Offline
Member

Registered: 07/06/99
Posts: 2043
Loc: Indianapolis
Quote:
Originally posted by Samuel Catalino:


What part of "...it just shows that idiotic laws are in every state and those that enforce them are the same..." did you fail to understand?


The part where that supports what you claim your point was "crazy people and crazy politicians in Vermont"

First why use the term "idiotic" if the term you wanted was "crazy"?

Second, you fail to prove that the law in question is either idiotic or crazy, you merely assert that with no additional reasoning or evidence for that case.

Third you fail to prove that the politicians who passed the law are either idiot's and/or crazy.

Fourth, you claimed your point was about Vermont, yet the statement you used indicts each state equally.

Fifth, even if you had made the case that the law was idiotic or crazy, you'd need to show that it was representative of Vermont legislation generally in order to make as sweeping claim as you did. Surely one law out of all the laws is insignificant in determining the overall state of affairs in Vermont

Sixth, by mentioning his name, you include Howard Dean in the above assessment, so not only should you prove 1-5 above generally, but prove that Dean specifically is either idiotic and/or crazy.

Surely an intellectual giant like you is capable of making a strong, well structured argument to support your assertion. Please Sam, share your wisdom with us all.

Don't bother replying Sam - I've programmed your typical responses into my Catalinotron5000 and this is what the predicted response is

"I can't believe I'm having this discussion with someone so ignorant. I don't see how anybody can look at the law and not believe its idiotic."

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#525239 - 10/30/03 09:21 AM Re: Nutty laws in Vermont....?
Dan Carroll Offline
Member

Registered: 04/04/02
Posts: 4588
Loc: Chicago, IL
Quote:
Originally posted by Samuel Catalino:
Wasn't this at a rally for President Bush at Legends field in Tampa back in 2001?


No. The rally was for Jeb Bush. George Bush was speaking there.

Quote:
Again, what does this have to do with Jeb Bush as I believe it was Tampa Police that were involved?


Jeb Bush rally. Florida law enforcement.

Quote:
Also, the charges were dismissed by the State Attorney.


After they were imprisoned for the duration of the rally, rendering their right to protest null and void.

Pretty simple situation, Sam: possibly silly law enforcement in Vermont vs. outright batshit insane law enforcement in Florida.

Somehow the same, in Catalinoland.

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#525240 - 10/30/03 09:24 AM Re: Nutty laws in Vermont....?
TTROY Offline
Member

Registered: 07/18/01
Posts: 781
Loc: Columbus, OH, USA
Sam it looks like from your original point you have some beef with some previous laws that Dean signed....not this one.

Dean had nothing to do with this --although in later post you assert that even behind the scenes he was masterminding it.....

Come out and say what you want to say.... there is something you still WANT to say but are beating around the BUSH.(so to speak)


Come on we know you can do it.
_________________________
Of Course that's just my opinion, I could be wrong.....but not likely.

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#525241 - 10/30/03 09:26 AM Re: Nutty laws in Vermont....?
Dean R Milburn Offline
Member

Registered: 07/06/99
Posts: 2043
Loc: Indianapolis
Quote:
Originally posted by Dan Carroll:


After they were imprisoned for the duration of the rally, rendering their right to protest null and void.

Pretty simple situation, Sam: possibly silly law enforcement in Vermont vs. outright batshit insane law enforcement in Florida.

Somehow the same, in Catalinoland.


Is there a good summary of this case available online? Prior restraint of the first amendment is a very serious issue, and something that the courts have not tended to support or look kindly upon, nor should they. Anyway, I'd like to know more.

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#525242 - 10/30/03 09:52 AM Re: Nutty laws in Vermont....?
Dan Carroll Offline
Member

Registered: 04/04/02
Posts: 4588
Loc: Chicago, IL
I'm having some trouble finding a full legal summary, because as Sam says, the arrest never went to court. There are some ACLU press releases on the lawsuit, but that's about it.

The overlapping facts I can gather from different news sources are as follows:

One adult man and two middle-aged women showed up at the rally. They were in a crowd of people who were holding pro-Bush signs, and they held up two signs of their own. One said "June Is Gay Pride Month", and the other said "Investigate Florida Votergate".

A policeman approached them and told them they could stay if they got rid of the signs. They said no, they were going to stay and keep their signs. They were taken into custody until the rally was over and the Bushes were gone.

If anyone can find a better summation of what went on, I'd love to see it too. (And I'd obviously encourage anyone to dig deeper than my little cross-news-source-overlap summary.)

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#525243 - 10/30/03 05:48 PM Re: Nutty laws in Vermont....?
Samuel Catalino Offline
Member

Registered: 04/04/99
Posts: 4447
Quote:
Originally posted by Dan Carroll:


No. The rally was for Jeb Bush. George Bush was speaking there.


After they were imprisoned for the duration of the rally, rendering their right to protest null and void.

Pretty simple situation, Sam: possibly silly law enforcement in Vermont vs. outright batshit insane law enforcement in Florida.

Somehow the same, in Catalinoland.


Wrong again in Carrolland.

I have before me the ticket that would get you in this event.

It states: Tampa Bay Welcomes President George W. Bush. No mention about Jeb.

Underneath that is the time and the place and when the program began.

Which just proves that Dan should not make statements about events he does not know anything about.

Well, your first post said federal security, then you went to state, but you may get to the truth that it was neither. Wanna take another guess?

Try the TPD that provided the bulk of security, why do you the think these people are suing the city of Tampa instead of the state?

Of course it helps when you live near the area in question.
_________________________
"If we lose a hundred troops a week, then Dean will be our next Prez." Jack V, avid Dean supporter with no concern for the troops.

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#525244 - 10/30/03 05:51 PM Re: Nutty laws in Vermont....?
Samuel Catalino Offline
Member

Registered: 04/04/99
Posts: 4447
Quote:
Originally posted by dlmccaslin:
Actually, laws in West Virginia make it legal to pick up roadkill, as long as you kill it. It keeps the costs down for the state.

Of course, when the law was passed it made leadlines around the country of the "look at the stupid hick" variety, and West Virginia became a little bit more of a laughing stock. To everyone, I'd assume, except for Mr. Catalino, who apparently feels there's nothing wrong with hauling dead, possibly diseased carcasses around.


Well unless you are a vegetarian, you eat dead carcasses. You must remember that just because they are shrink wrapped, it does not change what they are.
_________________________
"If we lose a hundred troops a week, then Dean will be our next Prez." Jack V, avid Dean supporter with no concern for the troops.

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#525245 - 10/30/03 05:53 PM Re: Nutty laws in Vermont....?
Samuel Catalino Offline
Member

Registered: 04/04/99
Posts: 4447
Quote:
Originally posted by TTROY:
Sam it looks like from your original point you have some beef with some previous laws that Dean signed....not this one.

Dean had nothing to do with this --although in later post you assert that even behind the scenes he was masterminding it.....

Come out and say what you want to say.... there is something you still WANT to say but are beating around the BUSH.(so to speak)


Come on we know you can do it.


It is clear that he had nothing to do with the original law; however, he was in the legislature when it was amended in 1985 and in 1991, so I am sure that he had something to add in the law...
_________________________
"If we lose a hundred troops a week, then Dean will be our next Prez." Jack V, avid Dean supporter with no concern for the troops.

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#525246 - 10/30/03 05:58 PM Re: Nutty laws in Vermont....?
Samuel Catalino Offline
Member

Registered: 04/04/99
Posts: 4447
Quote:
Originally posted by Dan Carroll:
I'm having some trouble finding a full legal summary, because as Sam says, the arrest never went to court. There are some ACLU press releases on the lawsuit, but that's about it.

The overlapping facts I can gather from different news sources are as follows:

One adult man and two middle-aged women showed up at the rally. They were in a crowd of people who were holding pro-Bush signs, and they held up two signs of their own. One said "June Is Gay Pride Month", and the other said "Investigate Florida Votergate".

A policeman approached them and told them they could stay if they got rid of the signs. They said no, they were going to stay and keep their signs. They were taken into custody until the rally was over and the Bushes were gone.

If anyone can find a better summation of what went on, I'd love to see it too. (And I'd obviously encourage anyone to dig deeper than my little cross-news-source-overlap summary.)


You forgot to mention the commotion that was stirred up by the signs and some of the confrontation as well, but you got it right.

At any rate, I think the ACLU has its' hands full helping Michael remove the feeding tubes from his wife.
_________________________
"If we lose a hundred troops a week, then Dean will be our next Prez." Jack V, avid Dean supporter with no concern for the troops.

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#525247 - 10/30/03 06:12 PM Re: Nutty laws in Vermont....?
TTROY Offline
Member

Registered: 07/18/01
Posts: 781
Loc: Columbus, OH, USA
It is clear that he had nothing to do with the original law; however, he was in the legislature when it was amended in 1985 and in 1991, so I am sure that he had something to add in the law...

SAm do you have his voting record handy before you made these allegations.....

You did not you made a baseless alegation without any knowledge on whether Dean had anything to do with said law.


Your bias is showing....
_________________________
Of Course that's just my opinion, I could be wrong.....but not likely.

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