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#580824 - 12/10/10 05:22 PM Re: Q for JB [Re: shjonescrk]
Alexander Ness Offline
Member

Registered: 09/17/03
Posts: 3692
Loc: Minnesota
WTF did you just say?

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#580828 - 12/10/10 11:06 PM Re: Q for JB [Re: Paul W. Sondersted, Jr.]
Troy Lightbourne Offline
Member

Registered: 05/03/10
Posts: 543
Originally Posted By: Paul W. Sondersted, Jr.

So which stories do you believe? Or do all have no credence because if one is possibly untrue, then the rest are untrue? Is JB lying in some cases, but not others? Did he actually have a legitimate reason on one, but the rest are lies? Maybe two legitimate stories, but the others are lies? How do you decide? Or is it just easier to paint it all one color?


Unfortunately for Byrne, the cloud of suspicion looms over all of his stories. I've always left the door open for the possibility ...however remote... that every one of his stories are a hundred percent accurate but for this to be the case, a lot of very specific dominoes have to fall in a very specific way over and over again. As I've said before, this would have to make Byrne, a superstar at the top of his game at the times of most of these incidents, the most persecuted guy in this business.

I would agree with what other posters have raised that Byrne may not necessarily be flat out lying. He might in fact believe his versions because he has rationalized them in such a way that they would be acceptable to him. He's not a quitter. He hasn't quit jobs due to his own over-sensitivity. It's always been a matter of moral necessity and justice. He HAD to quit. It was necessary and right to do so. Now we consider the issue of Byrne's perception and rationalization and it creates another cloud of suspicion that contaminates all of his stories especially since they all follow the same self-serving identical outline.

It isn't a matter of dismissing them all out right or believing them all. It's more like they all carry at least a little bit of a stink.
_________________________
"...M*****..." ---John Byrne, a sixty year old man unwilling to refer to Marvel Comics by their proper name because they'd canceled his book.

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#580829 - 12/11/10 03:38 AM Re: Q for JB [Re: shjonescrk]
Bendrix Offline
Member

Registered: 07/26/04
Posts: 295
Originally Posted By: shjonescrk
This reminds me of my brother. He shared many houses and flats with various people before me and him bought a house together. He told me that he had fallen out with everyone he had ever shared with to which I shrugged my shoulders, not really paying attention. Within 15 months I'd fallen out with him, had moved out, costing me thousands of pounds and didn't talk to him for a couple of years* and we are just civil with each other now when we meeting. 400 miles helps as well. I don't think he ever realised the one constant in it all was him.

It was at my mother's deathbed, which is quite sad when you think about it.


Wow. Deja Vu. Just with the difference that I learned about the falling out my brother had with about anyone he had a business relation to some degree with after the fact I bought the house with him.
And he doesn't live in the house, so no need for me to move out.
And he, too, reminded me of Byrne in the way that he believes every mistake he ever made is somebody else's fault.

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#580835 - 12/11/10 12:37 PM Re: Q for JB [Re: Bendrix]
Paul W. Sondersted, Jr. Offline
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Registered: 07/22/01
Posts: 4593
Loc: Sparks, Nevada, United States
Therein lies the weirdness. Where has it been stated (except by a few Detractors™) that JB believes that every mistake he ever made is somebody else's fault?
This is a driven fantasy concocted by a few detrimental personalities.
Obviously JB won't dwell on the mistakes he has made (who wants to do that?), but just because he avoids such subjects does not mean that he is exempt from them.
What we are seeing is probably just the tip of the iceberg. Everybody makes mistakes (DUH!). Even I have made one or two.

And no, this does not open the door to ask for examples of anything. And no, not providing any examples does not prove anything nor does it disprove anything. That's not the point.

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#580836 - 12/11/10 12:48 PM Re: Q for JB [Re: Paul W. Sondersted, Jr.]
Alexander Ness Offline
Member

Registered: 09/17/03
Posts: 3692
Loc: Minnesota
Well, Paul does have a point even if it isn't evidence. My dad and brother in law Phil were the sort who felt bad and tried to make up for things that they had done, wrongly, but would NEVER apologize or explain or discuss their mistakes. Some people just don't go there.

Whether it is right or wrong to do so is entirely another issue. I think people ought to be upfront but that doesn't mean they are.

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#580837 - 12/11/10 01:31 PM Re: Q for JB [Re: Paul W. Sondersted, Jr.]
Ceci n'est pas une chaussette Offline
Member

Registered: 12/19/05
Posts: 2831
Originally Posted By: Paul W. Sondersted, Jr.
Where has it been stated (except by a few Detractors™) that JB believes that every mistake he ever made is somebody else's fault?


Paul is attempting to move the goalposts; a logical fallacy.

This conversation has not been about every mistake Byrne has ever made. It's been about every book Byrne has ever quit prematurely. And as far as that goes...

X-Men: Byrne blames Claremont.

Fantastic Four: Byrne blames increased editorial interference

Superman: Byrne blames Dick Giordano

Next Men: Byrne blames the comics market

Danger Unlimited: Byrne blames retailers

Avengers West Coast: Byrne blames "a bone-head EiC who did not pay attention."

Captain America: Byrne blames Jim Shooter

Hulk: Byrne blames the Editor in Chief.

Indiana Jones: Byrne blames Jim Shooter and LucasFilm.

She-Hulk: Byrne blames Bobbie Chase.

X-Men (second run): Byrne blames Jim Lee.

This is all from Byrne's FAQ. These are his stated reasons.
_________________________
"When one says 'Africa,' it refers to Africa in the Euro-colonized sense, not the damn bush country or whatever."
- Ed Gauthier, DCP

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#580838 - 12/11/10 01:34 PM Re: Q for JB [Re: Ceci n'est pas une chaussette]
Alexander Ness Offline
Member

Registered: 09/17/03
Posts: 3692
Loc: Minnesota
You forgot Lab Rats

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#580839 - 12/11/10 01:37 PM Re: Q for JB [Re: Alexander Ness]
Ceci n'est pas une chaussette Offline
Member

Registered: 12/19/05
Posts: 2831
So did everyone else. ZING.

But seriously, didn't Lab Rats get canceled?
_________________________
"When one says 'Africa,' it refers to Africa in the Euro-colonized sense, not the damn bush country or whatever."
- Ed Gauthier, DCP

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#580840 - 12/11/10 01:41 PM Re: Q for JB [Re: Ceci n'est pas une chaussette]
Alexander Ness Offline
Member

Registered: 09/17/03
Posts: 3692
Loc: Minnesota
Yes I guess. Good point.

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#580843 - 12/11/10 02:38 PM Re: Q for JB [Re: Ceci n'est pas une chaussette]
Allen Montgomery Online   content
Member

Registered: 05/08/00
Posts: 6915
Originally Posted By: Ceci n'est pas une chaussette
X-Men (second run): Byrne blames Jim Lee.

Byrne didn't quit Jim Lee's X-Men. He was not given pages from the next issue to continue.
_________________________
"The trouble with being a ghost writer or artist is that you must remain anonymous without credit.
If one wants the credit, one has to cease being a ghost and become a leader or innovator."
— Bob Kane

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