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#596240 - 03/02/12 01:53 AM Can Rush Limbaugh Listeners Be Christian?
Carlton Donaghe Offline
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Registered: 11/23/98
Posts: 1619
Loc: the American Desert
While almost everyone who posts here is a much nicer person than myself, I realize there aren't many here who are very religious.

Republicans are often called "Values Voters" because they claim to be Christians.

At the same time, it's been demonstrated that there are no Republican politicians who would dare to speak against their spiritual leader, Rush Limbaugh.

I don't know if Rush Limbaugh claims to be a Christian. He is not one. There's nothing but the filthiness of excrement inside that man.

Yesterday, Rush went on his radio program and called the young woman who testified before a House panel regarding the importance of contraception a "slut" and a "prostitute."

Today, Rush went on air and took it even further, saying that if she's going to get taxpayer funded contraception, she should post videos of herself having sex online so that he could see them.

I saw the video of him saying these words. The expression on his face is mean and cruel, and there's the kind of evil in his voice that comes from carnal lust.

The values of the man who spoke these lines are not Christian values.

You can't listen to this-- and I mean listen to it, not just hear it-- and be a Christian.

People like Rush Limbaugh want to convince people our President is not a Christian, that he is not even really an American.

I'm saying that Rush Limbaugh is not a Christian, nor are his listeners.

Finally, I know I'm preaching to the choir here-- though most of y'all are too nice (or too disinterested in religion) to say these things.

I'm saying them because I want to condemn anyone who calls themselves a Republican and a Christian and doesn't drive this man and his kind out of the party.

God Damn each and every one of you. I hate you for what you are doing to this country.

( smile )
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Without Wax,
Carlton Donaghe
somewhere along the Rio Grande

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#596255 - 03/02/12 03:27 PM Re: Can Rush Limbaugh Listeners Be Christian? [Re: Carlton Donaghe]
Ted Kilvington Offline
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Registered: 05/10/99
Posts: 1080
Loc: Mason, MI, USA
As a Christian, Carlton, let me just say: I agree with you.

However, according to people like Rick Santorum and Pat Robertson, United Methodists such as myself are not Christians either.

My definition of a Christian: someone who both believes in Christian metaphysics AND makes an effort to follow Christ's teachings. Both are necessary, belief and sincere attempts at a Christ-like life. Regardless of denomination, if you don't do both, you're not a Christian.

If you say, "I like the philosophy that is attributed to the alleged Jesus", you're not a Christian.

If you say, "I'm a devout _________ (insert denomination), but I don't see why I should help others", you're not a Christian.

Jesus will decide who spends eternity with Him, and the rest will indeed be damned.
_________________________
Ted J. Kilvington, Jr.

*****

"I still have that comic, only now it's in liquid form!"

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#596256 - 03/02/12 04:05 PM Re: Can Rush Limbaugh Listeners Be Christian? [Re: Ted Kilvington]
MightyQuin Online   content
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Registered: 01/26/02
Posts: 1069
Loc: Tallahassee,FL
Originally Posted By: Ted Kilvington


Jesus will decide who spends eternity with Him, and the rest will indeed be damned.


I can agree with you and Carlton about what a poor excuse for a human being Rush Limbaugh is, but this idea of eternal punishment for transgressors never seemed very 'christian' to me. Guess I won't be able to count myself among the saved!

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#596257 - 03/02/12 04:11 PM Re: Can Rush Limbaugh Listeners Be Christian? [Re: Ted Kilvington]
Joe Lee Offline
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Registered: 06/22/01
Posts: 12277
Rush doesn't have a daughter, does he have sisters, a mom? He's had several wives.

Rush called what by all accounts, is pleasant young laws student, a "slut" for admitting she uses birth control? Even though something like ninety-eight percent of women use birth control at one time or another. Is Rush's own wife a slut? Does his wife use contraceptives, or are we to assume that they don't have sex, because he's been married several times for many years, but has no children to show for it. So they must not be having sex, because using contraception is a sin and sex for any reason other than procreation is a sin too right?

It seems to me there are always some people that feel anyone disagreeing with their religion is an abomination, and by "disagree" I mean even merely existing and not living by their rules is somehow an attack on their religious freedom. And any attack no matter how rude or even slanderous, on these people is justified. And in some cases they felt obligated.

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#596258 - 03/02/12 04:17 PM Re: Can Rush Limbaugh Listeners Be Christian? [Re: MightyQuin]
Lawson Offline
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Registered: 11/11/02
Posts: 11978
Loc: Lexington, Ky.
As someone of no religious faith, I realized long ago that there is no connection between religion and morality.

There are nice religious people whose faith prompts them to do good in the world, and there are self-righteous assholes who rationalize their shabby behavior by praising Jeebus.

The Catholic Church child-sex scandals are enough to show us what sort of awful activity men can justify to themselves if they are Christian and, therefore, saved by God.

Rush Limbaugh is not a good person in any useful sense of the word "good." I've no idea if he's a Christian -- I believe he says he is, and I don't read minds -- but to me, it's hardly the point. He's not kind, honest, tolerant or compassionate.

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#596262 - 03/02/12 04:36 PM Re: Can Rush Limbaugh Listeners Be Christian? [Re: Lawson]
Joe Lee Offline
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Registered: 06/22/01
Posts: 12277
I'm one of "those people" Santorum talks about that went to college and lost my religion. I prefer to think of it as growing up and making up my own mind. He thinks it was brainwashing by liberals. Whatever.

But I've been asked by people about morality and atheism. How do you know right from wrong without religion. As if most people were not inherently empathetic and would never do the right thing unless their was a threat of Hell.

I've often wondered if people who seem to be so immoral but also so religious, and so conspicuously self-righteous are in fact, often sociopaths trying to hide behind the letter of religious laws, like some kind of video game cheat sheet, or walk through. They have no real feeling for what's right or wrong and they rely on doctrine alone as a guide, but being without empathy or any emotional connection to right and wrong, they frequently get tripped up in the actual practice.

I knew a woman who wouldn't help her cousin a single mother, (babysit, donate old baby clothes), all because she didn't want to reward her sin. Not being a religious person, but having been raised catholic I was struck by how cold this was, whatever happened to things like, "Judge not, lest ye be judged," “Whatsoever you do to the least of my people, that you do unto me,” crap like that? I'm not religious, but I would think most people would feel empathy toward their situation and want to help out. But here she HAD religion and all it's words of wisdom and was still heartless.

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#596264 - 03/02/12 04:51 PM Re: Can Rush Limbaugh Listeners Be Christian? [Re: Lawson]
Carlton Donaghe Offline
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Registered: 11/23/98
Posts: 1619
Loc: the American Desert
Well said, Lawson. But it turns out, the Bible contains many verses where Jesus himself lays out ways to know if someone is Christian or not. A simple public declaration is not enough, and, in fact, the body of Christ is supposed to be self-policing. There are times when Christians ARE called on to judge.

I remember the time I was best man at a wedding, where the bride was the daughter of the pastor of the church. To cut a long story short, I didn't feel like Dylan's Mr. Jones, I was more like Hawthorne's Young Goodman Brown. I saw so much hypocrisy on display I felt physically ill.

Jesus appeared out of nowhere and told me, "Carlton, you'd be better off going to hell than going to church." It turns out, he's got a special plan for what calls itself "Christian" but is not.

And you know, with him standing there, I just had to ask, "I thought Oral Roberts said you was 900 feet tall."

And he said, "Oral WHO?"

Because you know, he said, "Many shall stand before me and say, 'Lord, Lord, did we not heal the sick and raise the dead, and raise billions of dollars through our television ministries that provided us with a lavish lifestyle, in your name?' And I will say, depart from me, you workers of iniquity, for I never knew you."

When I was a kid, the first book of the Bible I ever read all the way through was the book of Revelation. It's like a freaking awesome Galactus story.

But I always wondered, how could there be the church it talks about in the last days, who worshiped the anti-christ, and still thought they were Christians.

Well, now I know. I don't call myself a Christian. I figure if Jesus Christ Lord God Almighty is going to take the time to come warn me himself in person, then hell no I ain't gonna mess with those people.

But there they are.
_________________________
Without Wax,
Carlton Donaghe
somewhere along the Rio Grande

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#596265 - 03/02/12 04:59 PM Re: Can Rush Limbaugh Listeners Be Christian? [Re: Carlton Donaghe]
Carlton Donaghe Offline
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Registered: 11/23/98
Posts: 1619
Loc: the American Desert
Oh, also, Ted-- right on.

Being a Christian means giving up everything you have to serve God. That doesn't mean poverty, but it does mean putting it all in his service.

God said, "You cannot serve both God and Money." You can't be a politician taking money from lobbyists and putting that ahead of the good of the American people. You can't be a slimy weasel doing a talk show saying anything to get more money. You can't work in private equity, amassing fortunes for some at the expense of others. You just can't do it.
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Without Wax,
Carlton Donaghe
somewhere along the Rio Grande

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#596267 - 03/02/12 05:15 PM Re: Can Rush Limbaugh Listeners Be Christian? [Re: Carlton Donaghe]
Carlton Donaghe Offline
Member

Registered: 11/23/98
Posts: 1619
Loc: the American Desert
Several advertisers have bailed on the NeoFascist's radio program in light of his hateful comments.

Proof of my suspicions that neither Limbaugh nor his followers are Christian will be found in the fact that none of them will repent of their sins. Instead, they will howl and cackle with the laughter of jackals and demons rejoicing in iniquity.
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Without Wax,
Carlton Donaghe
somewhere along the Rio Grande

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#596268 - 03/02/12 05:22 PM Re: Can Rush Limbaugh Listeners Be Christian? [Re: Carlton Donaghe]
Ceci n'est pas une chaussette Offline
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Registered: 12/19/05
Posts: 2840
I always like linking to this article.

Of course, the problem is that modern American Christianity isn't a philosophy; it's a club. Which is probably good for Christianity... if it was taken seriously as a philosophy, you'd have to ask it questions like, "so your list of ten important things you have to know about morality finds time for working on Sundays and making gold statues, but not for rape or slavery?"
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#596279 - 03/04/12 11:09 AM Re: Can Rush Limbaugh Listeners Be Christian? [Re: Joe Lee]
MBunge Offline
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Registered: 07/19/01
Posts: 3386
Loc: Waterloo, Iowa, United States
Originally Posted By: Joe Lee
Rush called what by all accounts, is pleasant young laws student, a "slut" for admitting she uses birth control?


I've always wanted to defend conservatives when liberals start going on and on about how right wingers are consumed with sexual hang ups and frustrations. I've always felt that was just a cheap and easy way for lefties to avoid dealing with the moral and ethical dimensions of sexual activity. Clearly, I was wrong. While the religious liberty argument over covering contraception in health insurance isn't complete BS, the commentary from the Right over the subject can't be ignored. Those folks got some real problems.

Mike

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#596280 - 03/04/12 11:55 AM Re: Can Rush Limbaugh Listeners Be Christian? [Re: MBunge]
Charles Reece Offline
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Registered: 08/18/99
Posts: 10013
Loc: us of fuckin' a
Just to be clear, Limbaugh called a woman who wants government to pay for her contraception a slut and a prostitute. If a woman has enough money (she married Limbaugh) or good health care (not furnished by a religious institution) to furnish her with an endless supply of contraception, she is, according to his implication, neither a slut nor a prostitute. To the perverse conservative mindset, sex should be had by only those who can afford it, everything else is prostitution. If the sex is too cheap, you're a slut.
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The Gospel, wherein much Truth is written.

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#596281 - 03/04/12 02:49 PM Re: Can Rush Limbaugh Listeners Be Christian? [Re: Charles Reece]
Carlton Donaghe Offline
Member

Registered: 11/23/98
Posts: 1619
Loc: the American Desert
What that Fascist said wasn't an accident. He chose to express the issue in the most vile and demeaning way he could think of. Regardless of whatever point he was making, he was mean and cruel and crossed the line.

This reveals the inner man.

Just as it shows the moral quality of his listeners.

And, the Republicans are afraid of this man. That reveals where they're coming from, too.

Republicans are NOT the party of Christian Values. It needs to be said every single time the Republicans go on their self-righteous rampages.
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Without Wax,
Carlton Donaghe
somewhere along the Rio Grande

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#596282 - 03/04/12 03:01 PM Re: Can Rush Limbaugh Listeners Be Christian? [Re: Carlton Donaghe]
Carlton Donaghe Offline
Member

Registered: 11/23/98
Posts: 1619
Loc: the American Desert
Also, Charles, I forgot to point out that Rush Limbaugh is deliberately lying to distort the issue.

Ms. Fluke DOES NOT WANT TAXPAYERS TO PAY FOR HER BIRTH CONTROL!

You can't take ANYTHING they say to be true.

Ms. Fluke was simply saying that the university she attended, through which she and other female students had insurance, should offer birth control as part of the package.

Only Rush Limbaugh and Bill O'Reilly, both known frauds and liars, are saying she wanted taxpayers to pay for her birth control.

But again, I'm saying that shows the kind of people these folks are. And if you are a Republican or a Teabagger, and you agree with them, this is the kind of scum you follow. This is the kind of scum you are. I think you all need to publicly repent of your sins and sin no more.
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Without Wax,
Carlton Donaghe
somewhere along the Rio Grande

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#596283 - 03/04/12 03:20 PM Re: Can Rush Limbaugh Listeners Be Christian? [Re: Carlton Donaghe]
Carlton Donaghe Offline
Member

Registered: 11/23/98
Posts: 1619
Loc: the American Desert
Ms. Fluke's testimony.

Here guys, shove this up the ass of the next person who lies to you about what she said.

And for THIS Limbaugh slandered her. He deserves to lose his sponsors and be vilified for this.
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Without Wax,
Carlton Donaghe
somewhere along the Rio Grande

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#596286 - 03/05/12 10:32 AM Re: Can Rush Limbaugh Listeners Be Christian? [Re: MBunge]
Joe Lee Offline
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Registered: 06/22/01
Posts: 12277
Originally Posted By: MBunge
While the religious liberty argument over covering contraception in health insurance isn't complete BS,
I think many of the problems facing us today are worthy of reasonable debate, but politicians are often better served by arguments, than they are solutions. Especially when they have no real argument.

But I simply don't understand the arguments about contraception and abortion, mandatory invasive ultrasounds, etc., all from a party that fought against health care reform under the banners of "smaller government," and "Preventing government making your health-care decisions."


Edited by Joe Lee (03/05/12 10:50 AM)

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#596287 - 03/05/12 06:59 PM Re: Can Rush Limbaugh Listeners Be Christian? [Re: Joe Lee]
Carlton Donaghe Offline
Member

Registered: 11/23/98
Posts: 1619
Loc: the American Desert
As many as ten advertisers have now bailed on the Republican Fascist Leader, including Allstate and old-people internet service, AOL. In addition, a radio station in Hawaii has become the first station to drop his show.

A group of patriotic American female military veterans are urging the US military to drop the offensive hate-monger from the military radio stations. The fat liar had condemned Ms. Fluke when he distorted her testimony to claim that she wanted tax payers to pay for her birth control pills. Basing his opinion on this distortion, the liar called her a "slut" and a "prostitute." The American veterans said that they used birth control that was paid for by the US taxed payers. In effect, that Fascist Limbaugh called women in US uniforms sluts and prostitutes who should post sex videos online for him to watch.

One more thing: Again, in this issue, I've found that Republicans have been the most uninformed, or better, misinformed people in this debate. At all levels, defenders of Limbaugh's argument, if not Limbaugh himself, consistently mischaracterize all aspects of this argument, including Ms. Fluke's actual testimony.
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Without Wax,
Carlton Donaghe
somewhere along the Rio Grande

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#596294 - 03/06/12 02:08 AM Re: Can Rush Limbaugh Listeners Be Christian? [Re: Carlton Donaghe]
madget Offline
Member

Registered: 05/11/01
Posts: 4870
It's depressing to me that Limbaugh is successful in his life. But he is, and this flap does nothing to change it. I mean, oo, he made a stupid, controversial statement ... big news, there. So advertisers are leaving his show ... who cares? Maybe, best case scenario for those who despise him, his show falls apart, goes under. Who cares? Does he, even? He shouldn't have much reason to. The guy is 61, retirement age. He has enough money to fund a dozen lifetimes of luxury, a hot wife, and legions of stupid, adoring fans who will forever admire him. The dude could retire tomorrow and spend the rest of his life just taking it easy on a beautiful island somewhere, not a care in the world.

And to think that some people still believe in God ....

K

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#596295 - 03/06/12 05:27 AM Re: Can Rush Limbaugh Listeners Be Christian? [Re: madget]
Stephen Parkes Offline
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Registered: 09/24/09
Posts: 390
Loc: The Bristol, Cuba St
"Does he, even? He shouldn't have much reason to."

And yet, I suspect he does. He could have just maintained a "fuck you - I'm just calling it how I see it" approach, but he bowed to the pressure and apologised. Sure, it was an insincere apology, but he doesn't even accommodate those usually, does he? And advertisers pulling out in numbers is also not the normal reaction to his frequent verbal vomit. I don't follow the guy much, but I get the impression that being reined in at all is not something he usually has to contest with, so I suspect it's some sort of embarrassment to him.

Well, that's my more optimistic way of looking at it.


Edited by Stephen Parkes (03/06/12 05:33 AM)

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#596298 - 03/06/12 10:07 AM Re: Can Rush Limbaugh Listeners Be Christian? [Re: Stephen Parkes]
Joe Lee Offline
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Registered: 06/22/01
Posts: 12277
I would never have guessed the word "slut" was more offensive than "feminazi"

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#596299 - 03/06/12 10:11 AM Re: Can Rush Limbaugh Listeners Be Christian? [Re: Stephen Parkes]
Allen Montgomery Offline
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Registered: 05/08/00
Posts: 7089
Limbaugh is the centerpiece of the AM Hate Radio ensemble. If he gets taken down, that means everybody in the lineup will have to cool their rhetoric.

My previous job involved making trucks ready for delivery, so I drove [for a short distance] a dozen or more vehicles every night and I got to hear what radio stations the drivers listened to. Many of them listened to the Hate Radio. The shit that all those people on there spew is unbelievable — like if Weemie had the ability to stop other people from posting. The pressure to keep their main mouth is being exerted from many angles, not just the advertisers (although I'm sure all of the other douche-jocks are secretly salivating over the thought of movin' on up to take Limbaugh's slot).
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If one wants the credit, one has to cease being a ghost and become a leader or innovator."
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#596301 - 03/06/12 10:23 AM Re: Can Rush Limbaugh Listeners Be Christian? [Re: Allen Montgomery]
Ted Kilvington Offline
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Registered: 05/10/99
Posts: 1080
Loc: Mason, MI, USA
Apparently what got both Imus and Limbaugh in trouble was the reference to sex for money, i.e. "hos" and "prostitute", not the "sluts", "nappy-headed", or "feminazis" comments. Especially the implication that ANY woman who received insurance-covered-contraception was therefore "paid" by the insurer and/or their employer to have sex, and was therefore a prostitute.
_________________________
Ted J. Kilvington, Jr.

*****

"I still have that comic, only now it's in liquid form!"

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#596302 - 03/06/12 10:29 AM Re: Can Rush Limbaugh Listeners Be Christian? [Re: Ted Kilvington]
Allen Montgomery Offline
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Registered: 05/08/00
Posts: 7089
And her being a law student, I'm guessing Ms. Fluke has had probably at least hundreds of offers for free representation in a slander suit against Limbaugh/Clear Channel (which is privately co-owned by Mitt Romney's outfit Bain Capital, btw).
_________________________
"The trouble with being a ghost writer or artist is that you must remain anonymous without credit.
If one wants the credit, one has to cease being a ghost and become a leader or innovator."
— Bob Kane

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#596304 - 03/06/12 10:37 AM Re: Can Rush Limbaugh Listeners Be Christian? [Re: Allen Montgomery]
Joe Lee Offline
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Registered: 06/22/01
Posts: 12277
Originally Posted By: Allen Montgomery
...Limbaugh/Clear Channel (which is privately co-owned by Mitt Romney's outfit Bain Capital, btw).
WTF, Mitten has been struggling for rightwing street cred the whole primary and he's OWNED Limbaugh the whole time?

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#596306 - 03/06/12 12:36 PM Re: Can Rush Limbaugh Listeners Be Christian? [Re: Joe Lee]
Charles Reece Offline
Member

Registered: 08/18/99
Posts: 10013
Loc: us of fuckin' a
a pro-slutwalker chimes in:

Quote:
Sandra Fluke plays a role here, too. By making the case that women need insurance coverage that includes birth control—to protect their health in some cases, and in others, yes, simply to have sex—she is reminding us that of course this is part of who we are. We don’t have to modestly avert our eyes from that reality or keep quiet about it, either.
_________________________
The Gospel, wherein much Truth is written.

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#596310 - 03/06/12 04:05 PM Re: Can Rush Limbaugh Listeners Be Christian? [Re: Charles Reece]
Allen Montgomery Offline
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Registered: 05/08/00
Posts: 7089
26 advertisers have bailed now. He's already got more money than he could ever reasonably spend, but it would be nice to see him forced into retirement.
_________________________
"The trouble with being a ghost writer or artist is that you must remain anonymous without credit.
If one wants the credit, one has to cease being a ghost and become a leader or innovator."
— Bob Kane

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#596311 - 03/06/12 04:09 PM Re: Can Rush Limbaugh Listeners Be Christian? [Re: Joe Lee]
Allen Montgomery Offline
Member

Registered: 05/08/00
Posts: 7089
Originally Posted By: Joe Lee
WTF, Mitten has been struggling for rightwing street cred the whole primary and he's OWNED Limbaugh the whole time?

It's a strange relationship, isn't it? I doubt Romney was actually involved in the decision making process of buying up all the stock and taking Clear Channel private back in '08, but he does still receive a pension from Bain. So regardless of what Limbaugh says about Romney, Romney still profits from what Limbaugh says.
_________________________
"The trouble with being a ghost writer or artist is that you must remain anonymous without credit.
If one wants the credit, one has to cease being a ghost and become a leader or innovator."
— Bob Kane

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#596315 - 03/06/12 08:06 PM Re: Can Rush Limbaugh Listeners Be Christian? [Re: Allen Montgomery]
Carlton Donaghe Offline
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Registered: 11/23/98
Posts: 1619
Loc: the American Desert
Notice that Limbaugh didn't really apologize?

He was very specific in that he only apologized for those two words, but not for anything else he said.

There is no equivalence in what he has done and anything I've ever heard a liberal say, or even a libertarian, like Bill Maher. They've said crass things, then apologized.

Rush has been on a week-long rant, and hasn't really apologized at all.

Also, Peter Gabriel has asked that "Sledgehammer" no longer be used.

I'm more concerned about the Pretenders' song being used.
_________________________
Without Wax,
Carlton Donaghe
somewhere along the Rio Grande

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#596317 - 03/06/12 08:30 PM Re: Can Rush Limbaugh Listeners Be Christian? [Re: Carlton Donaghe]
Allen Montgomery Offline
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Registered: 05/08/00
Posts: 7089
I was wondering about "Sledgehammer" playing in the background, although I think I remember hearing it before. Is Gabriel asying he just now found about that? He's definitely used some Mannheim Steamroller music, and I'm pretty sure one of those pukes used the opening riff of Megadeth's "Angry Again."
_________________________
"The trouble with being a ghost writer or artist is that you must remain anonymous without credit.
If one wants the credit, one has to cease being a ghost and become a leader or innovator."
— Bob Kane

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#596330 - 03/08/12 11:29 PM Re: Can Rush Limbaugh Listeners Be Christian? [Re: Allen Montgomery]
Peter Urkowitz Offline
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Registered: 08/28/00
Posts: 3231
Loc: Salem, MA, USA
Back in the mid-nineties I used to listen to Limbaugh occasionally, and I think I remember him actively promoting a Mannheim Steamroller Christmas album? I may have that totally mixed up with something else, but he would spend long portions of an hour just talking about how much he loved this album and how it would make a great gift for the whole family.

In retrospect, that was probably paid advertising. That may explain part of his value to advertisers, the way he is willing to, not just play their commercials, but also give personal testimony to how much he loves Gold-Ban Medicated Powder or whatever. Maybe that's more common on radio than in other media, but at least some broadcasters try to keep at least a little bit of separation between their editorial or entertainment content and their ads. With Limbaugh, he revels in his advertising, he celebrates the fact that he's swimming in money from these corporations and he wants you to know about it. I don't know whether that's more honest, or just another kind of emotional manipulation.

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#596335 - 03/09/12 01:39 AM Re: Can Rush Limbaugh Listeners Be Christian? [Re: Peter Urkowitz]
Carlton Donaghe Offline
Member

Registered: 11/23/98
Posts: 1619
Loc: the American Desert
I see Bill Maher is advocating that people accept Limbaugh's apology, but he didn't come out and say that until people started bringing him up as a sign of the hypocrisy of the left.

I seem to recall there being quite a big dust-up when Maher used the c-word on Palin, just as there was when Letterman made the foul joke about Bristol.

Also, watch the videos of each of these three incidents, and it's obvious who's trying to be funny and who's being a mean goddamn son of a bitch. I won't even listen or consider the argument that Limbaugh is an entertainer in the same way as Letterman or Maher. That's just disingenuous and dishonest, and it's not an argument I'm going to let someone make who wants to claim they belong to the "Party of Values."

Second, Maher and Letterman made their jokes once, got hit by a backlash, and apologized.

Limbaugh went on a three-day, hate-filled tirade. His offense went way beyond simply the use of "those two words." As I pointed out earlier, there's no resemblance between what Rush Limbaugh reported Ms. Fluke said and what Ms. Fluke actually said. In order to make his argument that she wanted the taxpayer to pay for her pills, he had to completely distort what she actually said. So he creates a straw man, and argues against that.

His listeners, some of whom may be successful but none of whom seem very informed or have strong moral convictions, take his argument and use it to condemn a woman who was simply trying to argue that there was a medical need for birth control. In her actual testimony, she addressed most of the arguments later made against her, but Rush played on the fact that all his most of his listeners knew of her were the lies he himself fabricated.

For this, Rush has not apologized. In fact, he has rather pointedly said that he apologized only for "those two words," and not at all for anything else he has done. He doubled down on everything, and has continued to lie and distort the situation.

Therefore, it would be ridiculous to do what Bill Maher suggests, and accept Limbaugh's apology. He didn't really apologize at all. Maher just wants to cover his own sorry ass.
_________________________
Without Wax,
Carlton Donaghe
somewhere along the Rio Grande

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#596341 - 03/09/12 12:48 PM Re: Can Rush Limbaugh Listeners Be Christian? [Re: Carlton Donaghe]
MBunge Offline
Member

Registered: 07/19/01
Posts: 3386
Loc: Waterloo, Iowa, United States
Originally Posted By: Carlton Donaghe
I see Bill Maher is advocating that people accept Limbaugh's apology


Pundits of all stripes are essentially signatories to a mutual non-aggression pact. The idea that anyone be held accountable for the things they say is so threatening to them all, they present a largely unified front on the subject. Conservative blogger Andrew Sullivan has criticized the pressure put on Limbaugh's advertisers to drop him because he says you should fight "bad speech with good speech". Of course, that's exactly the approach that's been taken with Limbaugh for over 2 decades and we can see how successful it's been.

Mike

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#596345 - 03/09/12 06:06 PM Re: Can Rush Limbaugh Listeners Be Christian? [Re: Carlton Donaghe]
Gerald Offline
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Registered: 11/29/09
Posts: 1108
Originally Posted By: Carlton Donaghe


Second, Maher and Letterman made their jokes once, got hit by a backlash, and apologized.



Is this the apology Maher made?

"Well, you know, I've been through this so many times. There's a lot of people in America who have, of course, nothing to do except look for something to get mad at. And I've been a frequent target and I'm happy to provide that service. So, you know, I always say, as I've said many times in these kind of situations, if I hurt somebody's feelings, I'm always sorry about that, I'm not trying to hurt somebody's feelings. But if you want me to say I'm sorry what I said was wrong, no, sorry, I can't go there."
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#596347 - 03/09/12 07:28 PM Re: Can Rush Limbaugh Listeners Be Christian? [Re: Gerald]
Carlton Donaghe Offline
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Registered: 11/23/98
Posts: 1619
Loc: the American Desert
Gerald, I don't know if that's the apology, or even if Maher said it. There's no attribution. I have no idea what that quote refers to.

But let's take it at face value, and stipulate that Bill Maher said those words in reference to calling Sarah Palin the "c-word."

He's right.

First, all I hear from the Right is whining and crying and pointing fingers and saying 'but he said it, too!'

That's bullshit, and it's childish. Republicans, who like to talk a lot-- A LOT-- about taking personal responsibility, have a real talent for attempting to excuse their behavior by pointing to flaws on the other side.

Little kids do that. All right, little Johnny, if everybody else jumps off the bridge, does that mean you would, too?

One thing that I want to point out, in all this attempt to deflect blame, not one of these Republicans is condemning Rush Limbaugh. It's not like they're saying 'You're right, we should condemn Rush Limbaugh and any who say these things.' Republicans are saying, 'Why are you condemning Rush Limbaugh when you did not condemn Bill Maher?'

Bill Maher called Sarah Palin the c-word because she is an ignorant, hypocritical, lying, backstabbing bully who has an ugly, selfish sense of honor and decency that many people find repugnant. He called her that, because deep down, she's not a good person.

And he's right about that.

It's not wrong to call a foul human being-- or let's be charitable and say a human being who has a lot to repent before they can be reborn as a new person by the grace of forgiveness-- a 'foul human being' (or, you know, all that other).

THIS would have been the time for Mitt Romney to have said, "Well, I wouldn't have used those words."

Bill Maher apologized if he hurt her feelings, but he is a Libertarian (not a Liberal) who does not believe words are equivalent to sticks and stones. And he's right about that. He was saying Sarah Palin is ignorant. He's right about that.

Comparing Rush Limbaugh to that is a completely different thing.

Limbaugh went on for days, day after day, mocking a young woman who argued that women's insurance plans should include birth control because birth control has many more health-related uses than simply birth control, and that college students are poor and cannot afford the additional cost.

Rush Limbaugh lied about what she said, mischaracterized her testimony, and used this straw man argument to slander her.

I don't know how much, if anything, you know about our history of conservatives in our country, but men like Rush Limbaugh have been known to stoop to the very lowest of levels to intimidate women and minorities who dare to publicly disagree with them, and what Rush Limbaugh was doing was exactly that.

If someone listened to Bill Maher, and was not repulsed by his language, they would come away with an honest assessment of Sarah Palin. Crudely expressed, but honest, and defensible. If you take away "those two words" of Limbaugh's, you still come away with a complete misrepresentation of Sandra Fluke, an indefensible lie.

I want to ask you a pointed question, Gerald, and an honest man won't hem and haw in his answer:

Do you think what Bill Maher did and said about Sarah Palin is really in the same league as what Rush Limbaugh did and said about Sandra Fluke?
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#596351 - 03/09/12 11:22 PM Re: Can Rush Limbaugh Listeners Be Christian? [Re: Carlton Donaghe]
Charles Reece Offline
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Registered: 08/18/99
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How about we all agree that Maher's an idiot, too. This is all entertainment politics, not meant to be taken seriously. At least, it shouldn't be, but the Daily Show passes for critical thought.
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#596353 - 03/10/12 12:13 AM Re: Can Rush Limbaugh Listeners Be Christian? [Re: Carlton Donaghe]
Gerald Offline
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Registered: 11/29/09
Posts: 1108
Originally Posted By: Carlton Donaghe

Bill Maher called Sarah Palin the c-word because she is an ignorant, hypocritical, lying, backstabbing bully who has an ugly, selfish sense of honor and decency that many people find repugnant. He called her that, because deep down, she's not a good person.


Maybe he should articulate that and back it up with facts instead of lowering himself to using a derogatory word for a woman.




Quote:

I want to ask you a pointed question, Gerald, and an honest man won't hem and haw in his answer:

Do you think what Bill Maher did and said about Sarah Palin is really in the same league as what Rush Limbaugh did and said about Sandra Fluke?


I haven't heard the either quote in context or during the show. Btu from what I've read about both, I'd say Rush Limbaugh's treatment of the his target was more vicious.
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#596354 - 03/10/12 12:32 AM Re: Can Rush Limbaugh Listeners Be Christian? [Re: Gerald]
Gerald Offline
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Registered: 11/29/09
Posts: 1108
I had a long response typed up but this shit is so tired. Both sides trying to make the other look bad, while trying to downplay or excuse their own behavior. The groupthink mentality never ends.

Also, I find it funny that someone who strongly disagrees with the religious right is using religion to question the morality of someone else.


Edited by Gerald (03/10/12 12:33 AM)
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#596355 - 03/10/12 02:48 AM Re: Can Rush Limbaugh Listeners Be Christian? [Re: Gerald]
Carlton Donaghe Offline
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Registered: 11/23/98
Posts: 1619
Loc: the American Desert
First, before I say anything else, Gerald, let me address your last statement.

I do not believe that the Republican Party is a party of Christian Values. They certainly claim that, but the arguments advanced by Gingrinch, Santorum, Bachmann, Romney, Paul, Boehner, or any of their spokesmen are not Christian by any stretch of the imagination. The opinions and positions held by the Family Research Council, by Gary Bauer, by Ralph Reed, by Kenneth Copeland, by any of these people, are not Christian.

How else are you going to show that they are hypocrites but by holding them up to the words they themselves use to condemn the left?

I don't talk a lot about this, Gerald, but I was born again in my 21st year. I was raised an anaabaptist: The baptism of infants is meaningless superstition. The only baptism that matters is when one is an adult, and has a mature, fully formed conscience and knows the difference between right and wrong. I was baptized in a church that believed in the fire of the Holy Ghost, I'll say that much for it. I studied to be a preacher. I studied with a group of ministers from a variety of denominations, including with an incredibly enthusiastic Pastor George W. Ferguson of a small black baptist congregation.

I've long since discarded the mythology and superstition, and I actually related here the story of when I ended my association with the worldly body that calls itself the Christian Church, but I do believe it is better to do good than to do evil.

Because the Republicans have chosen to wrap their lies in a pretense of being Christian, then I think they need to be judged with that judgment.

One of the reasons I post here is to test my arguments. I have friends in law school whom I test most of my arguments with. But most of them are pretty young and don't know Christian anything. Well, I do know the Bible. I do know the books of the New Testament. Most liberals don't, and therefore, they are at a disadvantage when some conservative goes spouting their religious crap. I'm not that way, and I've got enough respect for Jesus and God in me that it really pisses me off to see these right wing sons o' bitches mock all of it with their hypocrisy.

Read the Bible sometime, Gerald. It doesn't matter if you're a Christian or not or ever want to be. It's one of the foundational documents of Western Civilization. When you read the four Gospels, you'll see that Jesus was kind and gracious and forgiving to everyone except for one specific class of people.

Unlike Rush Limbaugh and most Southern Baptists, he didn't condemn the adulteress, or the tax collector, or the drunkards, or the common working man. He forgave them. He wouldn't have bitched about his taxes going to help her, he would have rendered unto Caesar then given her his own cloak, regardless of how much sex she'd been having.

On the other hand...

Have you ever heard the Commandment, "Thou shalt not take the name of the LORD thy God in vain;"?

That's only part of it. After the semicolon, the rest of it says, "for the LORD will not hold him guiltless that taketh His name in vain."

Have you ever wondered what that means? Most grandmothers interpret it to mean not to cuss and use "swear words."

But interpret it in terms of the Christian revelation, especially in that those who are saved are the "Bride of Christ."

If my poor old friend gets married, and his new bride takes his name in a fancy ceremony in front of God and everybody, but then everybody in town sees her sleeping with any man that winks at her, is she really my poor old friend's wife?

Of course not. She's taken his name in vain.

Republicans make a big damn deal about being the party of faith and Christian values, and yet every argument they make is in favor of greed and selfishness. Their highest goal is money.

You can't serve both God and Mammon.
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#596358 - 03/10/12 04:14 AM Re: Can Rush Limbaugh Listeners Be Christian? [Re: Gerald]
Allen Montgomery Offline
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Registered: 05/08/00
Posts: 7089
Originally Posted By: Gerald
Maybe he should articulate that and back it up with facts instead of lowering himself to using a derogatory word for a woman.

He did. Watch his Yahoo special from a couple of weeks ago.
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#596359 - 03/10/12 04:14 AM Re: Can Rush Limbaugh Listeners Be Christian? [Re: Carlton Donaghe]
Allen Montgomery Offline
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Posts: 7089
Originally Posted By: Carlton Donaghe
You can't serve both God and Mammon.

Oh, you're just making that shit up.
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If one wants the credit, one has to cease being a ghost and become a leader or innovator."
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#596362 - 03/10/12 12:40 PM Re: Can Rush Limbaugh Listeners Be Christian? [Re: Carlton Donaghe]
Charles Reece Offline
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Registered: 08/18/99
Posts: 10013
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Quote:
I do know the books of the New Testament. Most liberals don't, and therefore, they are at a disadvantage when some conservative goes spouting their religious crap.


http://www.evilbible.com/
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#596366 - 03/10/12 03:12 PM Re: Can Rush Limbaugh Listeners Be Christian? [Re: Charles Reece]
Carlton Donaghe Offline
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Registered: 11/23/98
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Loc: the American Desert
Hey, Charles. It's obvious the God of the Old Testament evolves over time. Even though the references have mostly been purged, He starts off, in Genesis, as a male with a wife (Astoreth), and with a fairly normal-sized humanoid that can be physically wrestled with.

The Israelites invoked His name in some incredibly wicked slaughter and immorality, much as they do today. There's not a whole lot of God in Israel's Ultra-Orthodox: They're really no different than those foul Wahabi Muslims or those rat-bastard Taliban. Or Rick Santorum.

Jewish thought found its full flower in the what we now call Christianity, although it was simply a radical new strain of Judaism originally that really has to be seen in the context of the times.* In fact, I think there's enough evidence out there to show that James Christ, Jesus' brother, had become a leader not just of the Jerusalem "church," but of Jewish thought, and that they were the ones who brought upon themselves the Roman siege that led to Masada. In the aftermath of Masada, and the diaspora that followed, Jewish thought fought hard to purge itself of this new strain.

*I would advance the Roman philosopher Epictetus as evidence that the philosophies which crystallized in Christian philosophy were in existence in the Roman world in those days. Christianity could, in some ways, be seen as the "Romanization" of Judaism.
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#596371 - 03/10/12 09:17 PM Re: Can Rush Limbaugh Listeners Be Christian? [Re: Carlton Donaghe]
Carlton Donaghe Offline
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Registered: 11/23/98
Posts: 1619
Loc: the American Desert
It was pointed out to me earlier this evening that what I was fumbling around trying to say is that the real difference between what Bill Maher said and Rush Limbaugh said, and why they are not equivalent, is that what Maher said was offensive, but what Limbaugh said was potential libel.

That is, one you make a stink over if you're a big damn baby, the other you sue someone for defamation.
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#596372 - 03/10/12 11:53 PM Re: Can Rush Limbaugh Listeners Be Christian? [Re: Carlton Donaghe]
Allen Montgomery Offline
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Registered: 05/08/00
Posts: 7089
Maher also broke down the differences further on Real Time last night.
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If one wants the credit, one has to cease being a ghost and become a leader or innovator."
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#596374 - 03/11/12 04:12 PM Re: Can Rush Limbaugh Listeners Be Christian? [Re: Ceci n'est pas une chaussette]
Ted Kilvington Offline
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For what it's worth, the banner ad on the side of my screen for this thread is for ChristianMingle.com.
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#596398 - 03/12/12 10:46 PM Re: Can Rush Limbaugh Listeners Be Christian? [Re: Ted Kilvington]
Carlton Donaghe Offline
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Registered: 11/23/98
Posts: 1619
Loc: the American Desert
I get one for becoming a pastor!
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#596420 - 03/13/12 11:42 PM Re: Can Rush Limbaugh Listeners Be Christian? [Re: Carlton Donaghe]
Gerald Offline
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Registered: 11/29/09
Posts: 1108
Originally Posted By: Carlton Donaghe


Because the Republicans have chosen to wrap their lies in a pretense of being Christian, then I think they need to be judged with that judgment.


So you're going to judge people using religion, because they were judging people using religion? Sounds like you're just continuing the cycle.



Quote:
Most liberals don't, and therefore, they are at a disadvantage when some conservative goes spouting their religious crap.

Why would you argue politics or social issues with someone who's basing their reason on an interpretation of some ancient, religious text?

Never argue with a fool. Onlookers might not be able to tell the difference.

Quote:
right wing sons o' bitches mock all of it with their hypocrisy.

Continuing the cycle of us vs them with the derogatory generalizations.

Quote:

Read the Bible sometime, Gerald. It doesn't matter if you're a Christian or not or ever want to be. It's one of the foundational documents of Western Civilization. When you read the four Gospels, you'll see that Jesus was kind and gracious and forgiving to everyone except for one specific class of people.

I try to stay away from religion. I very much enjoyed philosophy in college though.

Quote:

Unlike Rush Limbaugh and most Southern Baptists, he didn't condemn the adulteress, or the tax collector, or the drunkards, or the common working man. He forgave them. He wouldn't have bitched about his taxes going to help her, he would have rendered unto Caesar then given her his own cloak, regardless of how much sex she'd been having.


That's the problem, people who want to appropriate religion for their arguments when it suits them. If you can make a case without resorting to "WWJD," then I'll start taking you seriously.

This preoccupation by party cheerleaders to contstantly find things to make the other side look bad while simultaneously bending over backwards to make excuses for their own side is not productive at all.
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#596422 - 03/13/12 11:55 PM Re: Can Rush Limbaugh Listeners Be Christian? [Re: Gerald]
Gerald Offline
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Registered: 11/29/09
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Bill Maher in regards to the Limbaugh controversy:

“I don’t like it that people are made to disappear when they say something, or people try to make them disappear when they say something you don’t like. That’s America. Sometimes you’re made to feel uncomfortable, okay?”

Limbaugh distorted this woman's testimony and implied that she was like a prostitute. Should advertisers be forced to continue advertising with that idiot even if they lose sales?

Should people NOT complain and NOT voice their opinions to these advertisers?

I think Maher's personal experiences have made him biased. Maybe he's still butt hurt that his ABC show got canned based on his ignorant statement. When he was discussing SOPA/PIPA on his show recently he mentioned that people just want free shit, which is not why the majority of people were against that legislation. But he claims alot of people bootlegged his Reliiousity movie, so again, his personal investments have tainted his reason.
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#596423 - 03/14/12 12:20 AM Re: Can Rush Limbaugh Listeners Be Christian? [Re: Gerald]
Carlton Donaghe Offline
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Registered: 11/23/98
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Loc: the American Desert
Gerald, you are correct that my reasons for going after the Republicans on this issue were entirely derogatory.

My goal was indeed to shame good, honest people who really might want to be Christian, but have gotten caught up in the mindless hatred of Rush Limbaugh.

I wanted to see if I could use their own way of thinking to condemn them completely for supporting his view.

But sir, I can make a completely secular, albeit nationalistic, argument against Rush Limbaugh that can still mark where he crossed the line from the simply vulgar language of a Bill Maher into the hateful (and illegal) intimidation of a corrupt sheriff in the Deep South.

As you acknowledge, in order to justify the insults that Rush Limbaugh made to Ms. Fluke, he first had to completely misrepresent everything she actually said.

This done, he then went on to use hateful and potentially libelous language against her not on just one episode, not just on two, but three. And even once he apologized, he continued to lie and distort the case.

Yes, both Maher and Limbaugh used ugly language. That's bad, but that-- in and of itself-- is a matter of free speech. In addition, as some have pointed out, Maher was on a private cable program you have to pay for to see on a channel that is clearly labeled as an outlet for adult-only programming, and Limbaugh was on free American airwaves.

It wasn't just that Limbaugh used vile language to insult a woman. In that, there's equivalence with Maher. It was that he was attempting to distort the public debate with lies in such a way as to intimidate and smear not just one woman, but many women in an issue that is important to many women, in a vile and personal attack intended to shut HER up. He even addressed her parents, mocking that they should be proud of their 'nymphomaniac' daughter.

Rush Limbaugh has the largest audience in talk radio. His influence in the Republican party is so great that no Republican politician has ever spoke out against him without having to back one or two days later to retract his statements.

When Rush said those things, he was influencing a lot of people in the debate using misinformation.

That hurts this country. How can people make up their minds on an important issue when their political leaders continually distort and lie about the issues?

They can't.

And Republicans, who goose-step in unison, do this to a far greater degree than the spineless and uncoordinated Democrats.

That hurts my country, and I don't like it.

Gerald, can you acknowledge that, beyond the ugly language used by both sides, there is a real and pernicious difference in what the Republicans are doing and have been doing for some time, and the what the Democrats do?

None of our current Republican candidates for president is willing to say that evolution is true. None of them is willing to say that global warming is real and that it is being exacerbated by man's activities.

Yes, both parties play political games, and that's why I'm an independent. But I can see that there is something different about the Republicans these days, something ugly.

I really need you to tell me different, honestly.
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#596428 - 03/14/12 04:55 AM Re: Can Rush Limbaugh Listeners Be Christian? [Re: Carlton Donaghe]
ChrisW Offline
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Registered: 11/25/00
Posts: 10034
Loc: Lincoln, Nebraska USA
Remember when rock stars were the ones who would influence people with their awful language? Now they play "Lying Ass Bitch" to Michelle Bachmann and slap ho's for Obama. It's the Mighty AM Radio Titan that truly manipulates the nation's minds and must be suppressed.

AM Radio!!! Spoooooooooooky!!!!

Luckily liberals love women
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#596429 - 03/14/12 05:11 AM Re: Can Rush Limbaugh Listeners Be Christian? [Re: ChrisW]
ChrisW Offline
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Wait, this Ed Schultz guy called Michelle Bachmann a "right-wing slut", and then Sandra Fluke goes on his show? This is why I just started saying "cunt" and "twat" freely once Sarah Palin was nominated. There's no way liberals were going to restrain themselves or hold to any consistent standards.

If Herman Cain hadn't (allegedly) had some relationship with unnamed women, there'd be a whole new batch of words liberals would be using these days, like liberals had for Colin Powell and Condoleeza Rice. Ah well, we'll just have to wait for Allen West. Or Bobby Jindal. Or...


Edited by ChrisW (03/14/12 05:19 AM)
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#596433 - 03/14/12 09:22 AM Re: Can Rush Limbaugh Listeners Be Christian? [Re: ChrisW]
Ceci n'est pas une chaussette Offline
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Registered: 12/19/05
Posts: 2840
Originally Posted By: ChrisW
Wait, this Ed Schultz guy called Michelle Bachmann a "right-wing slut"...


This obviously mattered a great deal to you. You're so outraged on her behalf, you can't even get her name right.

Quote:
There's no way liberals were going to restrain themselves or hold to any consistent standards.


That's what I love about you, Weemie. You never have to wait for the irony, or the lack of self-awareness. It's always right there in a neat little package.

You are right about one thing, though. Liberals were so willing to give Schultz a pass that he was... immediately suspended without pay from his show? Okay then, false alarm; your record of being 100% wrong about everything remains safely intact.
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#596434 - 03/14/12 10:30 AM Re: Can Rush Limbaugh Listeners Be Christian? [Re: Ceci n'est pas une chaussette]
Ceci n'est pas une chaussette Offline
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Registered: 12/19/05
Posts: 2840
I might add, there's a handful of bigger problem with this whole sniffling and wiping your nose and saying, "But... but Ed Schultz said a bad word too!"

1) Two wrongs don't make a right. I'm amazed this has to be explained, but here we are.

2) Schultz's bad word isn't comparable to Limbaugh's situation. Because Limbaugh isn't in trouble for using a bad word. Limbaugh's in trouble because he delivered a three-day hateful screed against women, part of which involved the use of bad words. When called on it, he doubled down and said worse things about women. Then, only once he started losing advertisers, he apologized only for the use of bad words.

Complaining that other people don't get in trouble for using bad words is an attempt to whitewash Limbaugh's screed into, "okay, so he used a bad word. Whatever." It's incredibly dishonest, and a tacit endorsement of that hateful screed as acceptable behavior.
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#596443 - 03/14/12 12:19 PM Re: Can Rush Limbaugh Listeners Be Christian? [Re: ChrisW]
Joe Lee Offline
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Registered: 06/22/01
Posts: 12277
Originally Posted By: ChrisW
Wait, this Ed Schultz guy called Michelle Bachmann a "right-wing slut",
Michelle Bachman is a public figure, and they are fair game. But I agree the guy was wrong to use such language, and I wouldn't blame Mr. Bachman for asking the fat ass Schultz to step outside. Any lack of reaction to Schults' comment is a testament to Limbaugh's superior celebrity.

That being said, the advertiser reaction isn't partisan.

It's a symptom of all of us getting fed up with the deteriorating level of discourse.

I personable young lady is asked to testify to congress about health concerns, and is bullied by the biggest bully on the block in a rude and undeserved manner. People don't like bullies, and most people have a wife, sister or mother and wouldn't like it if they were called a slut, and a prostitute and asked to film themselves having sex by a top rated talk show host.

We've gotten to the point where if you disagree with anyone politically they are evil.

If you are pro birth control you are a slut.

If you are pro-choice you are a baby killer.

If you are a democrat you hate the US.

And it's class warfare simply to suggest that raising taxes on the wealthiest of people might be a better alternative than laying off police and teachers due to tightening budgets.

You can't just disagree with Obama, he is DESTROYING our country, simultaneously a racist of mixed race an elite, wealthy, nazi, communist, socialist and a terrorist, a secret Muslum, and devout follower of the evil Christian Rev. Wright, and a devout follower of a racist, terrorist Harvard Law professor.

Michelle Obama tries to bring light on the problem of childhood obesity and republicans claim she's trying to tell parents how to parent, she's trying to force them to conform to her evil will.

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#596444 - 03/14/12 12:20 PM Re: Can Rush Limbaugh Listeners Be Christian? [Re: Joe Lee]
Charles Reece Offline
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They were much nastier in the 19th century.
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#596445 - 03/14/12 12:22 PM Re: Can Rush Limbaugh Listeners Be Christian? [Re: Charles Reece]
Joe Lee Offline
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So?

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#596453 - 03/14/12 08:05 PM Re: Can Rush Limbaugh Listeners Be Christian? [Re: Joe Lee]
Allen Montgomery Offline
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Registered: 05/08/00
Posts: 7089
Originally Posted By: Joe Lee
I wouldn't blame Mr. Bachman for asking the fat ass Schultz to step outside.

Hyeah. Picturing that.
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If one wants the credit, one has to cease being a ghost and become a leader or innovator."
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#596454 - 03/14/12 08:43 PM Re: Can Rush Limbaugh Listeners Be Christian? [Re: Allen Montgomery]
Allen Montgomery Offline
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Weemie defends Limbaugh in an email to Mark Evanier.


Originally Posted By: Mark Evanier
If some guy on radio started denying the Holocaust and advertisers began fleeing him in droves, you’d nod and go, “Sure.”

I wouldn't bet on that.
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If one wants the credit, one has to cease being a ghost and become a leader or innovator."
— Bob Kane

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#596455 - 03/14/12 10:24 PM Re: Can Rush Limbaugh Listeners Be Christian? [Re: Allen Montgomery]
Joe Lee Offline
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Registered: 06/22/01
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Why don't liberals hate Schultz?

He's the sort of pundit that allows the right to claim "they do it too," he's loud, obnoxious, and nothing more than a left version of Limbaugh.

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#596460 - 03/15/12 12:03 AM Re: Can Rush Limbaugh Listeners Be Christian? [Re: Joe Lee]
Allen Montgomery Offline
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The difference being: Schultz's commentary is generally factually sound.
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#596470 - 03/15/12 07:17 PM Re: Can Rush Limbaugh Listeners Be Christian? [Re: Allen Montgomery]
Gerald Offline
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@Carlton

My issue is that you take and use the same methods as the group/people you're criticizing, while also complaining about those same methods. For example religion. I think that religion should stay out of politics. You either think that too or you don't. But apparantly if it suits your argument you find it okay to inject it into the conversation.

I'm not trying to say what Bill Maher did is the same as what Rush did because they're obviously different. But you were the first one to bring up Maher, and the first one to make excuses for him.

Maybe you think that I'm trying to take the spotlight off of Limbuagh with my posts, but I'm not. This forum is mostly all liberals who agree with you on Limbuagh (including me), so I don't see the point in preaching further to the choir.

However, I took issue when you started jumping through hoops to excuse Maher's comments. So far you've said what he said was okay because he apologized (which he didn't), he's a self proclaimed libertarian, because Palin is a bully, because it's an accurate description of her, because he's being funny and maybe some other things that I missed.

"Cunt" is a derogatory word for women. Would it have been just as okay with you hade he used a derogatory word based on someone being black, Jewish, gay, or hispanic?

If you want me to say that I think one party or group seems to be slightly less awful than the other, sure I can do that. But that's a pretty low standard that you and the American public have been conditioned to accept.

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#596471 - 03/15/12 08:39 PM Re: Can Rush Limbaugh Listeners Be Christian? [Re: Gerald]
Allen Montgomery Offline
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Originally Posted By: Gerald
"Cunt" is a derogatory word for women.

"Cunt" is a derogatory word referring to a part of a woman's anatomy, but can be applied to either gender. It means "an obnoxious or contemptible person." Applied to Sarah Palin or Michelle Bachmann, it is accurate; as would also be accurate applied to Rush Limbaugh.

"Slut" refers a looseness in personal standards, specifically the sexual variety. It can be applied to either gender, but only awkwardly so; the dictionary definition of "slut" refers only to females.
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#596472 - 03/15/12 09:03 PM Re: Can Rush Limbaugh Listeners Be Christian? [Re: Gerald]
Carlton Donaghe Offline
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Hi, Gerald. Okay, let's see...

Bill Maher used ugly, offensive language when he talked about Sarah Palin, and he was criticized for it by women's groups on the left, totally in contradiction to what the right claims.

But of all the rights we have in this country, the one right we don't have is the right to not be offended. Bill Maher is mean, that's bad. Boo hoo.

You are willing to admit that what Limbaugh did was worse. Yes, he went right past protected speech and into libel territory.

Both were offensive, one was unacceptable.

If you're arguing that we all oughtta be angels, that's a wonderful goal, but it's never going to happen. I personally try to be a better man today than I was yesterday, I often fail, but I always try. Not only that, I never use the "c"-word. I've had real arguments in my classroom with black students because I will not allow them to use the n-word. I don't care if they think it's okay because they are black, my classroom is not a democracy, and it won't be used there. But that's different than arguing that Huckleberry Finn should be banned or censored.

So, it's not something I celebrate that Maher used the c-word. But you know what? I do celebrate the fact that all I have to do is not go out of my way to pay extra money to bring him into my home if I don't want to hear him. There is absolutely no way, sitting here with my free broadcast TV, that I or anyone in my family is going to accidentally hear that offensive language coming out of Bill Maher's mouth. It's simply not allowed.

Bill Maher is not, in any sense of the word, a leader or a spokesman in the Democratic party. He does not influence opinion, he does not shape policy, and there is not a single Democratic politician that would hesitate to speak against Bill Maher on any issue.

You can't deny that.

I don't excuse Maher's comments, but I won't accept the argument that there's even any need to respond to Bill Maher in the same way that Rush Limbaugh's libelous, hateful, lying rant calls out for.

Bill Maher: Don't watch his show if it offends you. This is America.

Limbaugh: Sue his ass, boycott his sponsors, do whatever-- he crossed the line.

And it's there's just no equivalence between the Democratic Party and the Republican Party. It goes beyond a simple disagreement in policy. It's more than just a disagreement in economic policy.

People always truthfully speak about how you shouldn't demonize someone who honestly disagrees with you.

Gerald, I believe that's true, and I act like it.

But what the Republicans are doing is calling black, "white" and night, "day," and they are the ones demonizing and intimidating others into falling into line.

It's not the Democrats that, almost as a party, deny global warming.

It's not the Democrats that, almost as a party, ridicule and deny science, especially evolution, but also including physics, astronomy, and geology.

It's not the Democrats that are waging a war on women's reproductive rights and seeking to turn the clock back fifty years or more on women's health.

You are saying that you'll admit that the Democrats are "slightly less bad" than the other party.

Oh, that's so nice of you. And blind. I'm saying that right here, right now, we have a party that wraps itself in the flag while defiling everything our country stands for. Torture of prisoners was never an issue until George W. Bush and Dick Cheney began their ill-conceived and often criminal war on terror. Yes, there is a threat, but these two cowards crossed the line.

And then, I'm still stumped by how much it bothers you that I am pointing out that the Republicans-- almost as a party-- are complete religious hypocrites. Because I'm an atheist, am I not also allowed to be educated in Christian doctrine?

And if, because of my knowledge of Christian doctrine, even my knowledge of Protestant Evangelical doctrine, allows me to criticize Republicans with their very own words, are you trying to tell me there's something wrong with that?
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#596475 - 03/15/12 11:25 PM Re: Can Rush Limbaugh Listeners Be Christian? [Re: Carlton Donaghe]
Carlton Donaghe Offline
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I was reading something that illustrates that some people whom you'd otherwise figure were intelligent people are strangely dog-ass stupid, and I'd hazard a guess that a lot of it comes from places like Limbaugh, Beck, and Fox News perpetuating the ignorance of the Confederate past.

Southern voters speculate as to why Obama won.

Probably the biggest indictment one can make against southern Republicans is that they were people who literally changed political allegiance because they were against granting Civil Rights to black people. They actually hated the thought of black people being their equal so much that southern Democrats became Republicans en masse.

When you think about it, it completely explains their irrational hatred of our President. And Rush Limbaugh is a man of the South. In fact, wasn't he fired from ESPN because of racist remarks he made...?

One other thing I wanted to mention. I was reading an article on Politico, I think, in which a Republican was defending Rush Limbaugh, and trying to make argue there was hypocrisy from the left regarding the disparate treatment of Maher and Limbaugh by the left. He pointed out that it's the left that boycotts and wants to censor or have people removed-- the right doesn't do that, he claimed. I nearly choked. That statement, like nearly everything that comes from the Republicans, is a lie.

Let me point to the most recent example of the 'Million Moms,' or whoever that right-wing organization was, demanding Ellen Degeneres be removed as spokesperson for Target stores. See how that works? I just proved his statement was not true.

Again, I'm claiming this is the modus operandi of the Republican party. It was just recently that our resident nutjob, ChrisW was on here repeating shouting about the unfortunate acts of violence and rape that took place at some of the Occupy camps.

While he's busy blaming the violence on the protesters, it turns out that it's only the right who are making these allegations. Not that these unfortunate acts didn't happen, but it all cases where a suspect has been apprehended, it's been shown that these have been homeless people, mentally ill people, things of that nature, but not the protesters.

So what do you do when you have a political party who outright lie to the American people, whose positions are based on an intentional and completely erroneous understanding of the way the world works, and are kept in office by hateful, racist people who are dog-ass stupid?

All that is needed is for good men to stand by and do nothing.
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#596477 - 03/16/12 12:13 AM Re: Can Rush Limbaugh Listeners Be Christian? [Re: Allen Montgomery]
Peter Urkowitz Offline
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Posts: 3231
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Originally Posted By: Allen Montgomery


How nice for you that Evanier posted your letter and responded, Chris. It read to me like he demolished your objections entirely with his patented brand of reasonableness, although he did it in a friendly way.

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#596478 - 03/16/12 12:40 AM Re: Can Rush Limbaugh Listeners Be Christian? [Re: Carlton Donaghe]
Gerald Offline
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Registered: 11/29/09
Posts: 1108
Originally Posted By: Carlton Donaghe
And then, I'm still stumped by how much it bothers you that I am pointing out that the Republicans-- almost as a party-- are complete religious hypocrites.

To you they're hyprocrites. When you use religion as the measuring stick, it's always going to be subject because everyone interprets it differently. There's no right way.

Quote:

Because I'm an atheist, am I not also allowed to be educated in Christian doctrine?

I said, if you don't believe religion should be used to judge people, then you shouldn't do it either.


Quote:

And if, because of my knowledge of Christian doctrine, even my knowledge of Protestant Evangelical doctrine, allows me to criticize Republicans with their very own words, are you trying to tell me there's something wrong with that?


I'm saying it's pointless to argue religion doctrine with people because there's no concrete way of interpreting it. The Bible itself is full of contradictions. I've tried dealing with people like that. I've pointed out all the crazy things int the Old Testament to people who are anti-gay marriage because of what "the Bible says. But it doesn't matter because they're going to pick and choose what they want from the Bible just like you do.

People need to realize that you can't run a country based on one groups religion.
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#596479 - 03/16/12 12:56 AM Re: Can Rush Limbaugh Listeners Be Christian? [Re: Gerald]
Gerald Offline
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Posts: 1108
In regards to Limbuagh, I agree with you, and never said that what Maher did was the equiavlent of it.

As far as the Democractic party goes they seem to be about the same to me as Republicans in that they just do whatever will keep themselves in power. A substantial amount of them supported the Iraq War Resolution, and they even nominated a candidate who supported it as well! A large number of Democrats voted to grant the telecom companies immunity when they were shown to have been spying on US citizens. A number of them helped pass NDAA and a Democrat President signed off on it, which would allow US citizens to be denied their rights if they were merely SUSPECTED of being a terrorist or having terrorist ties.

That's why I avoid getting involved in the whole right vs left nonesense.
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#596486 - 03/17/12 05:39 AM Re: Can Rush Limbaugh Listeners Be Christian? [Re: Peter Urkowitz]
Stephen Parkes Offline
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Originally Posted By: Peter Urkowitz
Originally Posted By: Allen Montgomery


How nice for you that Evanier posted your letter and responded, Chris. It read to me like he demolished your objections entirely with his patented brand of reasonableness, although he did it in a friendly way.


Chris must be so happy to see that being made public.

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#596488 - 03/17/12 07:39 AM Re: Can Rush Limbaugh Listeners Be Christian? [Re: Stephen Parkes]
Allen Montgomery Offline
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It certainly creates an indelible link with that guy Weemie claims he never listens to.
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#596532 - 03/19/12 10:12 PM Re: Can Rush Limbaugh Listeners Be Christian? [Re: Allen Montgomery]
ChrisW Offline
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The alternative is "First they came for Rush Limbaugh, and I didn't speak up because I didn't listen to Rush."

If that's an incomprehensible concept to you, then you are a Nazi.
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#596533 - 03/19/12 10:15 PM Re: Can Rush Limbaugh Listeners Be Christian? [Re: ChrisW]
Allen Montgomery Offline
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It's not an incomprehensible concept, but your application of it certainly is. Limbaugh is the one directing his audience — some of whom are policy makers — to "come for" other people's liberties. The underlying context is often "do unto others before they do unto you."
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#596534 - 03/19/12 10:18 PM Re: Can Rush Limbaugh Listeners Be Christian? [Re: ChrisW]
ChrisW Offline
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Quote:
Chris must be so happy to see that being made public.


Heck, I was hoping he'd number them so he'd get to the claim about calling whatserface a whore. Mark Evanier freely quotes from people who say Anne Coulter would fuck a hippo to improve her q-rating and Michelle Malkin's prose sounds much better if you imagine her reading it out loud with a big, hairy set of balls in her mouth. Evanier admires his turn of phrase as a writer, but wishes he didn't say so because it might turn off people who don't already agree with him.

He also made several posts about why anybody was wrong to make a fuss about David Letterman putting some 14-year old at Yankee Stadium on nationwide tv and saying A-Rod would fuck her so hard a baby dropped out , but maybe Obama should give back the money.

[Ok, I'm mixing up a couple of things there, including viewpoints that Evanier has never expressed to my knowledge. I don't usually point out when I'm doing so, but for the slow of mind, I will say that I'm juxtaposing similar-but-different events - Letterman on the Palins at Yankee Stadium, plus Bill Maher's running commentary and providing a big chunk of change for the guy who wants to keep things pleasant for Sasha and Mahlia. See how I had to write a lot more to fully express a concept? I call it cartooning with words. But the idea is fully there in my original statement]

Of course he said that three years ago, and you didn't take him seriously then either. Fuck them nappy headed ho's.


Edited by ChrisW (03/19/12 10:22 PM)
Edit Reason: Rush texted me about some spelling errors
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#596535 - 03/19/12 10:28 PM Re: Can Rush Limbaugh Listeners Be Christian? [Re: ChrisW]
Carlton Donaghe Offline
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Registered: 11/23/98
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Chris seems to see others' bad behavior as a license for him to behave the same way; he sees others' not responding in the way he thinks they should as license to behave even worse.
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#596537 - 03/19/12 10:35 PM Re: Can Rush Limbaugh Listeners Be Christian? [Re: ChrisW]
Gerald Offline
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Registered: 11/29/09
Posts: 1108
@ChrisW

You're bothered about "the left" not being able to criticize their own, but then you, likewise, are unable to do the same.

Anyways, getting back to the topic of Rush, it's an interesting debate that Fluke sparked by making her testimony and it bears some good discussion. If Rush had a strong argument then he should of made some well-articulared points instead of implying Fluke is a nymphomaniac prostitute and distorting what she said.

The excuse of he's just a shock jock/entertainer, or whataboutwhentheleftdoesit is immature. If you're bothered by what was said about Malkin, Palin, and Coulter, and believe it's comparable to what Rush said, shouldn't you be disgusted with him as well?

Or is it more fun always saying "but they did it first!"
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#596538 - 03/19/12 10:37 PM Re: Can Rush Limbaugh Listeners Be Christian? [Re: ChrisW]
ChrisW Offline
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Registered: 11/25/00
Posts: 10034
Loc: Lincoln, Nebraska USA
Quote:
How nice for you that Evanier posted your letter and responded, Chris. It read to me like he demolished your objections entirely with his patented brand of reasonableness, although he did it in a friendly way.


Mark Evanier is pretty much always friendly, as far as I know. He has several different email addresses, depending on whether or not you give him permission to quote you. He's one of the few liberals who (publicly) makes a genuine attempt to look at the right-wing point-of-view as something other than irredemably evil and/or stupid. Palin said Letterman should be kept away from her daughter, and M.E's mind went to sex instead of the possibility that a 14-year old girl who knows how to use guns [they're all gun freaks, aren't they?] might be pissed off at the guy who just humiliated her on nationwide television for no other reason than that she was born.

I don't hold it against the guy, I just can't figure out why he blames Palin for making a bigger deal of it (something to do with campaigning). He does admit maybe Letterman should have apologized earlier, but spends far more verbiage on why Mama Palin is wrong to be so pissed off about Letterman's treatment of a 14-year old girl.

Of course you can do whatever you like to a 13 year-old girls' body against her will, and Allen Montgomery (plus others) will loudly defend you so long as you mouth liberal pieties. You can truly trash women and Mark Evanier will defend your turn of phrase and sigh that you might be turning away people who don't already agree with you.

You can be Anthony Weiner. Or Bill Clinton. Or John Edwards who was actually considered qualified for Vice-President by a major political party.
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#596539 - 03/19/12 10:39 PM Re: Can Rush Limbaugh Listeners Be Christian? [Re: ChrisW]
ChrisW Offline
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Loc: Lincoln, Nebraska USA
Quote:
Chris seems to see others' bad behavior as a license for him to behave the same way; he sees others' not responding in the way he thinks they should as license to behave even worse.


When you're willing to stop dismissing everything you don't like as 'you listen to too much Rush Limbaugh' [and cheer 41 Senators trying to get him shut down], then maybe I'll stop quoting liberals. Until then, to quote the (Lincoln, Nebraska native) Dick Cheney, go fuck yourself.
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#596540 - 03/19/12 10:44 PM Re: Can Rush Limbaugh Listeners Be Christian? [Re: ChrisW]
ChrisW Offline
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Quote:
You're bothered about "the left" not being able to criticize their own, but then you, likewise, are unable to do the same.


Because I don't care. Tina Fey and Charlie Sheen could each get a million bucks a week to star in "Sarah Palin's A Cunt" on NBC prime time and it wouldn't matter to me. I think it's a horrible idea and I'd be appalled at the notion, but "Sarah Palin is a cunt" t-shirts have been consistently on-sale since 2008. Geez, for all the racism in the country, you'd think they could think of something to say about Barack Obama, who just released a campaign ad against Sarah Palin.
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#596541 - 03/19/12 10:50 PM Re: Can Rush Limbaugh Listeners Be Christian? [Re: ChrisW]
Gerald Offline
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You don't sound like someone who doesn't care.
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#596542 - 03/19/12 10:55 PM Re: Can Rush Limbaugh Listeners Be Christian? [Re: ChrisW]
Allen Montgomery Offline
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Originally Posted By: ChrisW
David Letterman putting some 14-year old at Yankee Stadium on nationwide tv and saying A-Rod would fuck her so hard a baby dropped out

There's you caught in a lie. Letterman wasn't referring to the minor.
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#596543 - 03/19/12 11:00 PM Re: Can Rush Limbaugh Listeners Be Christian? [Re: Allen Montgomery]
ChrisW Offline
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But the minor is the one he put on television for the crime of going to Yankee Stadium.
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#596544 - 03/19/12 11:01 PM Re: Can Rush Limbaugh Listeners Be Christian? [Re: ChrisW]
ChrisW Offline
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And being born. Forgot about that one.
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#596545 - 03/19/12 11:06 PM Re: Can Rush Limbaugh Listeners Be Christian? [Re: ChrisW]
Allen Montgomery Offline
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Originally Posted By: ChrisW
Of course you can do whatever you like to a 13 year-old girls' body against her will, and Allen Montgomery (plus others) will loudly defend you so long as you mouth liberal pieties.

And there's you caught in two more lies, simultaneously. I don't support Polanski because of his political stances; and you don't have any solid evidence about the girl (or her mother's) will.


Originally Posted By: ChrisW
Or John Edwards who was actually considered qualified for Vice-President by a major political party.

Another lie. If any of Edwards' details were known in 2004, he most certainly would not have been Kerry's running mate.
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#596546 - 03/19/12 11:07 PM Re: Can Rush Limbaugh Listeners Be Christian? [Re: ChrisW]
Allen Montgomery Offline
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Originally Posted By: ChrisW
But the minor is the one he put on television for the crime of going to Yankee Stadium.

No, he didn't. You are a liar.
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#596549 - 03/20/12 01:37 AM Re: Can Rush Limbaugh Listeners Be Christian? [Re: Allen Montgomery]
ChrisW Offline
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Allen, you ignorant slut.

Quote:
And there's you caught in two more lies, simultaneously. I don't support Polanski because of his political stances; and you don't have any solid evidence about the girl (or her mother's) will.

Another lie. If any of Edwards' details were known in 2004, he most certainly would not have been Kerry's running mate.

No, he didn't. You are a liar.


Do any of Allen's fellow liberals want to actively take his side on these innocuous statements (for him)? Pretend you're all the Occupy Comicon movement and ignore me as most of you do after this post. Do you think his abusive and dismissive approach hurts or helps the liberal causes you share? For instance:

Quote:
and you don't have any solid evidence about the girl (or her mother's) will.


To me, this seems very callous of a (possible) rape victim, a very young one at that. Given Polanski's own testimony (and his victim's), it's strange that Allen takes such 'your mother' tactic. Would he dismiss Chelsea Clinton making such claims because he didn't like her mother? That was bad when Rush did it and it's no longer bad because liberals do it because... Finish that sentence.

But that's just my opinion, I could be wrong.
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#596550 - 03/20/12 01:58 AM Re: Can Rush Limbaugh Listeners Be Christian? [Re: ChrisW]
Gerald Offline
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Registered: 11/29/09
Posts: 1108
Originally Posted By: ChrisW
Do you think his abusive and dismissive approach hurts or helps the liberal causes you share? For instance:


I think the problem is you view everything as liberal vs conservative.
Quote:

To me, this seems very callous of a (possible) rape victim, a very young one at that.


I agree with you on this point. But possibly, the reason why people aren't jumping on Allen now is that everybody here already posted their opinion on the case, and Allen's assessment of it, in the Polanski Faces Extradition thread.



Quote:
That was bad when Rush did it and it's no longer bad because liberals do it because... Finish that sentence.

Why do you have to compare and bring everything to a liberal/conservative counter example?
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#596551 - 03/20/12 02:25 AM Re: Can Rush Limbaugh Listeners Be Christian? [Re: ChrisW]
Allen Montgomery Offline
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Originally Posted By: ChrisW
Allen, you ignorant slut.

Weemie, you moronic suckler on the public teat.

Originally Posted By: ChrisW
Do any of Allen's fellow liberals want to actively take his side on these innocuous statements (for him)?

There are no "sides" to this. There's factual reality, and then there's your lies.

Originally Posted By: ChrisW
To me, this seems very callous of a (possible) rape victim, a very young one at that.

Besides being older than me, she seems to have gotten over it a long time ago.


Originally Posted By: ChrisW
That was bad when Rush did it and it's no longer bad because liberals do it because... Finish that sentence.

Limbaugh stated inaccuracies and/or lies (which he made money off of). I stated facts.


Originally Posted By: ChrisW
But that's just my opinion, I could be wrong.

And always are.
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#596552 - 03/20/12 06:17 AM Re: Can Rush Limbaugh Listeners Be Christian? [Re: Allen Montgomery]
ChrisW Offline
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Loc: Lincoln, Nebraska USA
Quote:
Besides being older than me, she seems to have gotten over it a long time ago.


Is that your final answer?
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#596553 - 03/20/12 06:22 AM Re: Can Rush Limbaugh Listeners Be Christian? [Re: ChrisW]
ChrisW Offline
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In microcosm, we have the issue of civility in public discourse these days.

I'm looking for the right quote from Cerebus #186 for le mot juste, but don't have much time. There is no bridge that can be built between Allen and myself. Would anybody like to give a shot at explaining why to him? Not that it will help, but it would mean a lot if someone other than avid Rush Limbaugh listeners like myself are seen doing it publicly?

[It was actually Cerebus #185 and the passage I was looking for - the part about the bridge - is too long to type up.


Edited by ChrisW (03/20/12 08:44 AM)
Edit Reason: I had to go jump from a plane
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#596556 - 03/20/12 06:39 AM Re: Can Rush Limbaugh Listeners Be Christian? [Re: ChrisW]
Allen Montgomery Offline
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Originally Posted By: ChrisW
There is no bridge that can be built between Allen and myself. Would anybody like to give a shot at explaining why to him?

That's easy. It's because you are a liar.
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#596561 - 03/20/12 11:52 AM Re: Can Rush Limbaugh Listeners Be Christian? [Re: ChrisW]
MightyQuin Online   content
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Originally Posted By: ChrisW
There is no bridge that can be built between Allen and myself. Would anybody like to give a shot at explaining why to him?


Chris, Gerald just addressed this very well a few posts 'up'.

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#596562 - 03/20/12 12:00 PM Re: Can Rush Limbaugh Listeners Be Christian? [Re: MightyQuin]
Joe Lee Offline
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Personally I prefer as many bridges as possible, between allen and myself. Maybe some walls, rivers, lakes, fences, canyons...

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#596564 - 03/20/12 01:03 PM Re: Can Rush Limbaugh Listeners Be Christian? [Re: Joe Lee]
ChrisW Offline
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I'm not urging that you all harrass him endlessly. I tricked him up above into spewing nonsense about a 13-year old rape victim *and* her mother and he went for it without hesitation. He has to live the rest of his life being Allen Montgomery. No, I don't think that punishment is too cruel even though I wouldn't wish such a fate on Saddam Hussein or Osama bin Laden.

They had this problem at OWS. People trying to hang out and be friendly, and then they refuse to do anything about people like Allen. And the drummers. And the rapists. And the violent, destructive acts. But no one else on their own side calls them out on it.

Prominent liberals go on television and say there are no rapes at Occupy, zero, zilch, none, and liberals never publicly challenge that because providing a space for rapists to proliferate would contradict all their liberal fantasies, yet that's exactly what happened. If they were paid for what they said, it would be a falsehood exactly like Allen (and others on his side) claim to oppose in the first place.

Silence.

So is it all right for a black man to violently assault a woman like Chris Rock did? To me, that seems an extremly timely 'teachable' moment, but only people on the right seem to bring it up and obviously Rock's in no legal danger whatsoever. As a lesson for future behavior, how should we respond?
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#596566 - 03/20/12 01:25 PM Re: Can Rush Limbaugh Listeners Be Christian? [Re: ChrisW]
Allen Montgomery Offline
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Originally Posted By: ChrisW
I tricked him up above into spewing nonsense about a 13-year old rape victim *and* her mother and he went for it without hesitation.

Stating the facts only equals "spewing nonsense" to a liar such as yourself.


Originally Posted By: ChrisW
Prominent liberals go on television and say there are no rapes at Occupy, zero, zilch, none

And you have yet to provide any evidence that there were any.


Originally Posted By: ChrisW
So is it all right for a black man to violently assault a woman like Chris Rock did?

Amazing how you have confirmation of this when the trial proved otherwise.
_________________________
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If one wants the credit, one has to cease being a ghost and become a leader or innovator."
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#596567 - 03/20/12 01:28 PM Re: Can Rush Limbaugh Listeners Be Christian? [Re: ChrisW]
Joe Lee Offline
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Originally Posted By: ChrisW
Prominent liberals go on television and say there are no rapes at Occupy, zero, zilch, none, and liberals never publicly challenge that because providing a space for rapists to proliferate would contradict all their liberal fantasies, yet that's exactly what happened. If they were paid for what they said, it would be a falsehood exactly like Allen (and others on his side) claim to oppose in the first place.

Silence.
Actually I'm not sure what you're trying to prove here. Liberals are rapists? Liberals cover up rapes as much as Catholic churches?

Of the 17 incidents at Occupy events that Andrew Breitbart claimed were rapes, only seven incidents where actual assaults, with police identifying Occupy protesters as the victims, and only one assailant, just one, was also an Occupy member. That's a way better average than the republican party and the Catholic church. And probably better than Limbaugh too, I heard rumors that he went on a few of those child prostitution holiday excursions. Just a rumor I read somewhere. Probably not true. But he's at least a slut right? Why else would the unmarried(at the time) Christian, Limbaugh take viagra on a tropical island vacation? But wouldn't having the viagra at the very least, make him a slut?



Edited by Joe Lee (03/20/12 01:37 PM)

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#596568 - 03/20/12 01:35 PM Re: Can Rush Limbaugh Listeners Be Christian? [Re: Allen Montgomery]
Ceci n'est pas une chaussette Offline
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If it's so frustrating that nobody calls out these Occupy Wall Street rapists, maybe Weemie could try doing so. Perhaps by naming them?
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#596569 - 03/20/12 01:46 PM Re: Can Rush Limbaugh Listeners Be Christian? [Re: Ceci n'est pas une chaussette]
Joe Lee Offline
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Yeah it was back in 2009...

http://www.cbsnews.com/2100-201_162-1753947.html

So Rush is a slut at the very least. If his insurance paid even in part, for his viagara he's a whore too right?

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#596572 - 03/20/12 02:00 PM Re: Can Rush Limbaugh Listeners Be Christian? [Re: Allen Montgomery]
Joe Lee Offline
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Originally Posted By: ChrisW
Tina Fey and Charlie Sheen could each get a million bucks a week to star in "Sarah Palin's A Cunt" on NBC prime time and it wouldn't matter to me.
I think you'd have to go with cable for that one.

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#596573 - 03/20/12 02:07 PM Re: Can Rush Limbaugh Listeners Be Christian? [Re: Allen Montgomery]
Joe Lee Offline
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Originally Posted By: Allen Montgomery
The difference being: Schultz's commentary is generally factually sound.
Generally, well yeah, but he does some stretching sometimes to make a point. Way worse than Olbermann ever did.

I prefer my screaming diametrically opposed pundits to not stretch the truth at all. I like a firm ground with my righteous indignation.

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#596575 - 03/20/12 02:09 PM Re: Can Rush Limbaugh Listeners Be Christian? [Re: Joe Lee]
Allen Montgomery Offline
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Registered: 05/08/00
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Originally Posted By: Joe Lee
So Rush is a slut at the very least. If his insurance paid even in part, for his viagara he's a whore too right?

More than likely a child-rapist, since the Dominican Republic is a burgeoning sex-tourism center, in the Thailand tradition.
_________________________
"The trouble with being a ghost writer or artist is that you must remain anonymous without credit.
If one wants the credit, one has to cease being a ghost and become a leader or innovator."
— Bob Kane

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#596576 - 03/20/12 02:16 PM Re: Can Rush Limbaugh Listeners Be Christian? [Re: Joe Lee]
Allen Montgomery Offline
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Registered: 05/08/00
Posts: 7089
Originally Posted By: Joe Lee
Generally, well yeah, but he does some stretching sometimes to make a point. Way worse than Olbermann ever did.

I've only had cable since January, but I think the host I'm most impressed with is Chris O'Donnell.
_________________________
"The trouble with being a ghost writer or artist is that you must remain anonymous without credit.
If one wants the credit, one has to cease being a ghost and become a leader or innovator."
— Bob Kane

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#596577 - 03/20/12 02:22 PM Re: Can Rush Limbaugh Listeners Be Christian? [Re: Allen Montgomery]
Ceci n'est pas une chaussette Offline
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Registered: 12/19/05
Posts: 2840
Originally Posted By: Allen Montgomery
I've only had cable since January, but I think the host I'm most impressed with is Chris O'Donnell.


Well, he's got a lot to make up for after those Schumacher Batman movies.
_________________________
"When one says 'Africa,' it refers to Africa in the Euro-colonized sense, not the damn bush country or whatever."
- Ed Gauthier, DCP

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#596578 - 03/20/12 02:23 PM Re: Can Rush Limbaugh Listeners Be Christian? [Re: Allen Montgomery]
Joe Lee Offline
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Registered: 06/22/01
Posts: 12277
Originally Posted By: Allen Montgomery
Originally Posted By: Joe Lee
So Rush is a slut at the very least. If his insurance paid even in part, for his viagara he's a whore too right?

More than likely a child-rapist, since the Dominican Republic is a burgeoning sex-tourism center, in the Thailand tradition.
Possibly. Why else would the unmarried(at the time) Christian, Limbaugh take viagra on a tropical island vacation spot that is also a well known child prostitution destination?

But we have no evidence at this time to prove who or what he had sex with while he was there, just proof of his intention to be ready to have sex for a long time.

So all we are left with is, by his own standards he's at least a slut. Possibly a whore. Who wants to watch a college girl have sex. Online.

And he calls strong, assertive women, feminazis.

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#596582 - 03/20/12 03:30 PM Re: Can Rush Limbaugh Listeners Be Christian? [Re: Ceci n'est pas une chaussette]
Allen Montgomery Offline
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Originally Posted By: Allen Montgomery
I've only had cable since January, but I think the host I'm most impressed with is Chris O'Donnell.


Originally Posted By: Ceci n'est pas une chaussette
Well, he's got a lot to make up for after those Schumacher Batman movies.

Am I getting the name wrong? {googling...} Okay, I meant Lawrence O'Donnell. Mixing him up with Chris Matthews (who I would like better if he didn't always sound like he needs to spit). I only half-pay attention to it when I even have it on.
_________________________
"The trouble with being a ghost writer or artist is that you must remain anonymous without credit.
If one wants the credit, one has to cease being a ghost and become a leader or innovator."
— Bob Kane

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#596595 - 03/21/12 01:51 AM Re: Can Rush Limbaugh Listeners Be Christian? [Re: ChrisW]
Allen Montgomery Offline
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Registered: 05/08/00
Posts: 7089
Originally Posted By: ChrisW
I'm looking for the right quote from Cerebus #186

You definitely offer "more heat than light." My side is Facts. Your side is Lies. How does being revealed as a liar make you feel?

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If one wants the credit, one has to cease being a ghost and become a leader or innovator."
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