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#598117 - 06/04/12 05:11 AM
Re: John Byrne hates Avengers movie he hasn't seen
[Re: Allen Montgomery]
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Member
Registered: 09/24/09
Posts: 390
Loc: The Bristol, Cuba St
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I think I can safely say we all agree. ...that a guy whose claim to fame is one mildly successful (yet now defunct) television series was not allowed to veer from the prescribed formula of a five-year hyped tentpole? Thank you for finally admitting that. What I “admitted”, well actually, stated, in the comment you’ve quoted, was that despite you indicating otherwise, no one seemed to be arguing that Whedon was so powerful that Feige gave him carte blanche. Straw man arguments are a fallacy.
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#598127 - 06/06/12 01:09 PM
Re: John Byrne hates Avengers movie he hasn't seen
[Re: Jimbo]
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Registered: 05/08/00
Posts: 6909
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We're having a discussion Yes, and a discussion involves you saying something and then me saying something in response. Not you altering what I've said and then attributing that altered bullshit back to me. I enjoy conversing with you, but not if you're going to be rude. Then fuck off!
_________________________
"The trouble with being a ghost writer or artist is that you must remain anonymous without credit.
If one wants the credit, one has to cease being a ghost and become a leader or innovator." — Bob Kane
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#598128 - 06/06/12 01:13 PM
Re: John Byrne hates Avengers movie he hasn't seen
[Re: Stephen Parkes]
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Registered: 05/08/00
Posts: 6909
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no one seemed to be arguing that Whedon was so powerful that Feige gave him carte blanche. The argument was made by both Bungee and Reece that Scarlett Johansson's screen time was commandeered by Whedon. Which is complete bullshit. Whedon didn't even write the script. He just added in the jokes. My personal belief is that BW was chosen by producer Kevin Feige as the unifying element, since she hadn't been previously featured in her own movie, but perhaps there may have been some crowd-sourced reaction gauged after her performance in IM2 that dictated more screen time for her. I'm guessing the relationship between BW and Hawkeye was actually the element Feige wanted, but apparently the selection process for their characters didn't involve finding out if the two actors had any chemistry together. Renner looked like a tougher version of Jason Bateman in The Hurt Locker, and that's likely what they wanted for Hawkeye. Here he looked like a fatter version of James Spader or a young Robert Englund.
_________________________
"The trouble with being a ghost writer or artist is that you must remain anonymous without credit.
If one wants the credit, one has to cease being a ghost and become a leader or innovator." — Bob Kane
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#598132 - 06/06/12 05:34 PM
Re: John Byrne hates Avengers movie he hasn't seen
[Re: Allen Montgomery]
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Member
Registered: 07/13/01
Posts: 2747
Loc: New Zealand/Canada
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We're having a discussion Yes, and a discussion involves you saying something and then me saying something in response. Not you altering what I've said and then attributing that altered bullshit back to me. That's fair. I've seen it done before around various forums and thought it was a humorous way to illustrate my point, clearly you didn't find it funny and it upset you quite a bit. That wasn't my intent and I apologize for hurting your feelings. Due to my misunderstanding, the offer of peace previously made still remains open.
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Walla Walla Bing Bang.
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#598133 - 06/06/12 11:23 PM
Re: John Byrne hates Avengers movie he hasn't seen
[Re: Allen Montgomery]
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Member
Registered: 08/18/99
Posts: 10002
Loc: us of fuckin' a
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"The argument was made by both Bungee and Reece that Scarlett Johansson's screen time was commandeered by Whedon."
I didn't argue this, but it's right.
"Whedon didn't even write the script. He just added in the jokes."
Whedon wrote the screenplay. You can find plenty of info about it online if you want.
_________________________
The Gospel, wherein much Truth is written.
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#598134 - 06/07/12 07:23 AM
Re: John Byrne hates Avengers movie he hasn't seen
[Re: Allen Montgomery]
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Member
Registered: 07/19/01
Posts: 3386
Loc: Waterloo, Iowa, United States
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The argument was made by both Bungee and Reece that Scarlett Johansson's screen time was commandeered by Whedon. Which is complete bullshit. Whedon didn't even write the script. He just added in the jokes.
My personal belief is that BW was chosen by producer Kevin Feige as the unifying element, since she hadn't been previously featured in her own movie, but perhaps there may have been some crowd-sourced reaction gauged after her performance in IM2 that dictated more screen time for her.
I'm guessing the relationship between BW and Hawkeye was actually the element Feige wanted, but apparently the selection process for their characters didn't involve finding out if the two actors had any chemistry together. Renner looked like a tougher version of Jason Bateman in The Hurt Locker, and that's likely what they wanted for Hawkeye. Here he looked like a fatter version of James Spader or a young Robert Englund. Did you go off your meds or something, Allen? You usually manage to maintain the same jackass consistency in your posts, but this one is all over the map. You start out with the same willfully ignorant certainty but then you actually admit that you're just pulling all this out of your ass. Your unreasoning hatred of Whedon first forces you to deny him any involvement in The Avengers but then you wind up shitting all over the people you're giving credit to, which actually redounds to Whedon's benefit. Seriously, if you think Feige is the one who is really responsible for The Avengers, why have you wasted any time bitching about Whedon in the first place? Mike
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#598137 - 06/07/12 11:18 AM
Re: John Byrne hates Avengers movie he hasn't seen
[Re: Jimbo]
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Member
Registered: 05/08/00
Posts: 6909
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it upset you quite a bit. That wasn't my intent and I apologize for hurting your feelings. So you graduate from ventriloquism to mindreading. And you claim to understand discussion? the offer of peace previously made still remains open. Until you learn how to have an honest discussion, you can fuck off.
_________________________
"The trouble with being a ghost writer or artist is that you must remain anonymous without credit.
If one wants the credit, one has to cease being a ghost and become a leader or innovator." — Bob Kane
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#598138 - 06/07/12 11:20 AM
Re: John Byrne hates Avengers movie he hasn't seen
[Re: Charles Reece]
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Member
Registered: 05/08/00
Posts: 6909
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Whedon wrote the screenplay. You can find plenty of info about it online if you want. Tell me what Zak Penn did, then. IMDB credits Penn with the story, so I presume Whedon merely adapted that and doctored some dialogue. The article linked to earlier in this thread credits Whedon only with the humor elements.
_________________________
"The trouble with being a ghost writer or artist is that you must remain anonymous without credit.
If one wants the credit, one has to cease being a ghost and become a leader or innovator." — Bob Kane
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#598140 - 06/07/12 12:04 PM
Re: John Byrne hates Avengers movie he hasn't seen
[Re: Jimbo]
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Member
Registered: 06/22/01
Posts: 12277
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We're having a discussion Yes, and a discussion involves you saying something and then me saying something in response. Not you altering what I've said and then attributing that altered bullshit back to me. That's fair. I've seen it done before around various forums and thought it was a humorous way to illustrate my point, clearly you didn't find it funny and it upset you quite a bit. That wasn't my intent and I apologize for hurting your feelings. Due to my misunderstanding, the offer of peace previously made still remains open. Jimbo, what you did was fine, people do it around here all the time too. It's a perfectly acceptable way to make a point. He's just screwing with you. And as you should be able to tell by his response to your apology, "Until you learn how to have an honest discussion, you can fuck off," he's not worth the effort.
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#598144 - 06/07/12 12:42 PM
Re: John Byrne hates Avengers movie he hasn't seen
[Re: Allen Montgomery]
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Member
Registered: 08/18/99
Posts: 10002
Loc: us of fuckin' a
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IMDB credits both Whedon and Penn with the story. As Penn has stated, there was very little collaboration with Whedon on the script. He wrote an earlier script that Whedon didn't use. Here's a summary of the Writer's Guild's "story by" credit. Whedon wouldn't just get a "story by" co-credit (in addition to his page one re-write, sole screenplay credit) if all he had added were some jokes. Additionally, just compare the Avengers to Whedon vs. Penn's previous work. Which does it most resemble? Was the Hulk/Bruce Banner the same as Penn's version? Obviously not.
_________________________
The Gospel, wherein much Truth is written.
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