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#598485 - 06/15/12 07:51 PM Re: BEFORE WATCHMEN: MINUTEMAN #1 [Re: Allen Montgomery]
ChrisW Offline
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Registered: 11/25/00
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Loc: Lincoln, Nebraska USA
Quote:
When asked point blank in an interview if he based WEHttMoT on Superfolks, Moore denied it.


Because he didn't, and you're the only one pretending he did.
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#598486 - 06/15/12 07:56 PM Re: BEFORE WATCHMEN: MINUTEMAN #1 [Re: MBunge]
Charles Reece Offline
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Registered: 08/18/99
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Originally Posted By: MBunge
Originally Posted By: Allen Montgomery
Originally Posted By: MBunge
Van Gogh = Allen Montgomery?

Artist = paycheck?


If anyone can validly call themselves an artist, then the word can have no real meaning. What? Are standards only for everyone else?


I don't want to get into the middle of you and Allen, but I do think that anyone who creates art is an artist,* and can reasonably call themselves that. This doesn't entail anything about quality or evaluation (I prefer Cooke's art to Allen's, for example). Likewise, I'd call you a writer and a critic, even if you're not paid a cent for it (something that's getting harder to do these days).


*I should've added: "with an aesthetic goal of creating art of some kind." I wouldn't call just anyone drawing doodles on a magazine cover an artist. Nor would tweeting "you suck" make one a critic.


Edited by Charles Reece (06/15/12 08:03 PM)
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#598488 - 06/15/12 08:02 PM Re: BEFORE WATCHMEN: MINUTEMAN #1 [Re: ChrisW]
Allen Montgomery Offline
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Registered: 05/08/00
Posts: 6915
Quote:
When asked point blank in an interview if he based WEHttMoT on Superfolks, Moore denied it.


Originally Posted By: ChrisW
Because he didn't, and you're the only one pretending he did.

The archives of The Comics Journal are now available online for you to correct yourself.
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If one wants the credit, one has to cease being a ghost and become a leader or innovator."
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#598489 - 06/15/12 08:05 PM Re: BEFORE WATCHMEN: MINUTEMAN #1 [Re: Charles Reece]
Allen Montgomery Offline
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Registered: 05/08/00
Posts: 6915
Originally Posted By: Charles Reece
I prefer Cooke's art to Allen's

I do, too, but that's because a big chunk of Cooke's art is actually Milton Caniff's.
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"The trouble with being a ghost writer or artist is that you must remain anonymous without credit.
If one wants the credit, one has to cease being a ghost and become a leader or innovator."
— Bob Kane

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#598490 - 06/15/12 08:36 PM Re: BEFORE WATCHMEN: MINUTEMAN #1 [Re: Allen Montgomery]
MightyQuin Offline
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Registered: 01/26/02
Posts: 1062
Loc: Tallahassee,FL
Like Charles, I'm of a 'let's you and him fight' frame of mind, however I have to say that Allen has some pretty decent artistic chops. In fact, this morning when I read the original comment questioning this particular ability of his, I went to retrieve a couple of his works from the Sketch-a-Day thread in Creating Comics. They're gone, kaput, raptured! What happened?

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#598491 - 06/15/12 08:42 PM Re: BEFORE WATCHMEN: MINUTEMAN #1 [Re: MightyQuin]
Allen Montgomery Offline
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Registered: 05/08/00
Posts: 6915
I changed ISP's in January and my personal web space where those images were hosted is now invalid.
_________________________
"The trouble with being a ghost writer or artist is that you must remain anonymous without credit.
If one wants the credit, one has to cease being a ghost and become a leader or innovator."
— Bob Kane

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#598493 - 06/15/12 11:39 PM Re: BEFORE WATCHMEN: MINUTEMAN #1 [Re: Allen Montgomery]
MightyQuin Offline
Member

Registered: 01/26/02
Posts: 1062
Loc: Tallahassee,FL
I don't want to confuse ComiCon history with Julius Caesar's classic accounts of the Gallic Wars or anything, but that's too bad, there was some good stuff in there. I especially liked the portrait of the female singer in an art nouveau, steampunk style.

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#598527 - 06/16/12 06:18 PM Re: BEFORE WATCHMEN: MINUTEMAN #1 [Re: Allen Montgomery]
Joe Lee Offline
Member

Registered: 06/22/01
Posts: 12277
Originally Posted By: Allen Montgomery
Originally Posted By: Charles Reece
I prefer Cooke's art to Allen's

I do, too, but that's because a big chunk of Cooke's art is actually Milton Caniff's.
And there's another of those ambiguous accusations.

Again, this allen's way of accusing people of something that sounds like copying, but is ambiguous enough that he doesn't have to prove or defend his accusations.

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#598528 - 06/16/12 06:21 PM Re: BEFORE WATCHMEN: MINUTEMAN #1 [Re: Allen Montgomery]
Joe Lee Offline
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Registered: 06/22/01
Posts: 12277
Originally Posted By: Allen Montgomery
I changed ISP's in January and my personal web space where those images were hosted is now invalid.
Why not set up a Deviant Art site like Hunter did, a basic page is free, and there a wide variety artists of varying talent and experience.

If you are nervous about criticism, you can turn off the comments. But if you are open to it you might get helpful pointers.

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#598529 - 06/16/12 06:40 PM Re: BEFORE WATCHMEN: MINUTEMAN #1 [Re: Allen Montgomery]
Joe Lee Offline
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Registered: 06/22/01
Posts: 12277
Originally Posted By: Allen Montgomery
Originally Posted By: Joe Lee
And wasn't the ending of Watchmen lifted from an Outer Limits episode, "The Architects of Fear," by allen's logic Mr. Moore didn't do enough to tone down the obvious "lift."

What the fuck are you talking about? He made reference to The Outer Limits and that specific episode right in the comic. When asked point blank in an interview if he based WEHttMoT on Superfolks, Moore denied it.

If you're going to try and slag me, at least try to make it make sense.
I'm not trying to slag you you paranoid hayseed. If I'm wrong here I'm just misinformed. Wikipedia cites two articles, one from Wizard and one from Entertainment Weekly, and goes on to say, Moore claimed he ran across a guide to cult tv that featured "The Architects of Fear" episode, but it was after he wrote the ending, (a likely story!), and then quotes Len Wein saying "it simply stole the ending to an episode of 'The Outer Limits,' which Alan fully admitted!"

It's hard to believe he just ran across a show description with the same plot device. But even then, at the very least, Moore's addition of the reference is tacked on, if he didn't know of the similarity until finding the guide. And just making reference to the episode doesn't make it any less "lifting" the episodes plot to use as the ending in Watchmen. It doesn't make it an homage either.

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