A brief rant on spoilers.

Most of us try not to spoil surprises in new movies when we're talking about them with people.

But.

When can we finally say, "The coast is clear" and openly discuss what "Rosebud" turned out to be in "Citizen Kane"? How much time has to elapse before you can proceed without spoiler warnings? Weeks? Months? Years?

I still hear from people who say they want to see "The Avengers," and they're having a hard time avoiding the spoilers online and in conversation.

Yes, because IT OPENED MORE THAN TWO MONTHS AGO!

At some point, don't you either need to go see it or shaddup already and resign yourself to hearing about it second-hand?

Some people wait for movies to come to the secondary markets, like Netflix, PPV or DVD, or some even wait for free TV movie channels like FX.

Not everyone goes to the theater for every movie.

I just saw Transformers Darkside of the Moon for the first time on Netflix last weekend. And I would've never seen a Harry Potter film, except for ABC Family marathons.

What exactly is there to spoil about the Avengers movie? All the official trailers feature the content of the last twenty minutes, because pretty much nothing happens until then. Then it's not hard to guess how all the beats go after that.

The only semi-surprise was the S.H.I.E.L.D. agent (who I'm sure viewers only vaguely remember from the other movies) having a man-crush on Cap. His getting killed after that was pretty predictable, too.

Thanos? Doubtful anyone knows who that is.

So your input here is basically, Allen thinks the movie sucked, so why should anyone care? And toss in couple of spoilers for fun.

You're an ass.

This is news?


Your taste in movies and TV shows is probably more in line with people about forty years younger than you, sorry to have to tell you.

Said the guy who was texting live from the theater!

Forgive me if I've mentioned this story on here before:

Some years ago when my girlfriend was still with her ex, she and a group of friends were discussing the movie King Kong. Naturally the ending got mentioned, which anyone who's ever been born is aware of, and the ex apparently got quite irate. He was either unaware, or had forgotten the ending and was genuinely upset that everyone in their group had spoiled King Kong for him.

After a certain point it's up to the individual to avoid spoilers. I play video games, but I usually don't buy them as soon as they're realized. Even when I do play them right away it usually takes me longer to finish them than most people. The endings and cool moments get discussed online and I figure it's my job to avoid them.

Now if someone *knows* you haven't seen something and are keen, then they tell you the ending anyway, that's just them being a jerk or inconsiderate. Or both. In most cases though, it's your problem and yours alone.

You have to decide which is more important to you, the destination or the journey. For me it's the journey. If an experience can be spoiled with a simple recap, it's not a valuable experience to begin with. If it were, to "spoil" it would take more time for the description of it than just experiencing it firsthand.

I agree. But when is that point?

If a movie is still in theaters I think it's a safe bet not everyone has seen it. Especially today, with home theaters and so many secondary market choices.

I think it's probably safe to slip a spoiler on a movie that's been out for a few years, especially if you are talking with a group of people you are familiar with, but can you reasonably expect a twenty year old to have seen Citizen Kane yet? What about Casablanca, The Third Man, Man of La Mancha, Lawrence of Arabia, or even King Kong? I'm in my forties and I see a lot of movies and read a lot of books and I know I haven't seen every movie or read every book yet.

I think both the spoilee and the spoiler need to share the responsibility. Give a guy a heads up if you feel a spoiler coming on OR warn everybody you haven't seen something if the title comes up, so you can duck out of the conversation.

A perfectly reasonable choice to make. For yourself. Why do you make it for others by posting spoilers without any warnings? Maybe others might like both?

Plus, you are still not taking into account most M.Night Shyamalan films, dreadfully boring movies with O. Henry endings, that very often, have no value beyond their gimmick. Like The Village or The Sixth Sense, SPOILER ALERT, when you know Bruce Willis is dead the whole time, the movie sucks.

I don't believe it has to be one or the other. I'd like to be able to experience both the journey and the destination first hand.

I guess there's no hard and fast rules for it. If you're going to talk about a film I suppose it's a common courtesy to make sure whoever is in earshot has seen it. By that same token if a film has been and gone in theaters and you didn't see it, there has to be a level of acceptance that it may get spoiled.

So we have a pretty close one here so far.

allen feels spoiler warnings are never needed. And posted warning free Avengers spoilers live as he watched the film, within the first week or two of release.

Lawson thinks two months is enough.

I'm sticking with spoiler warnings are always just common courtesy.

And Jimbo seems to be taking the most reasonable stance so far with, "...if a film has been and gone in theaters and you didn't see it, there has to be a level of acceptance that it may get spoiled."

Would that be two votes for The Avengers still needing Spoiler warnings, Two against? A tie? We need more votes...

In the case of that one MNS movie, I disagree. It's actually a more nuanced group of performances when you know, and saves the viewer from wondering the whole time wtf was up with the goofy tighty-whitey guy from the first act.

However, if you thought the movie sucked after you knew the ending, knowing the ending beforehand wold have allowed you more freedom to decide not to waste your time seeing it in the first place.

You apparently wish to live in a world without advertising. In which case, you would have never heard of the thing to experience it in the first place. Conundrum.

As it happens, in the cases of films that I know I'm going to see anyway, I actively avoid trailers.

How would you even be aware of their existence?


And I'm guessing you don't watch that many movies.

Haha, oh no, I watch plenty of movies. It's a rare case where I don't watch a trailer, but for films like say, The Avengers, I knew I was going to see it -of course I was well aware of it- but I didn't watch any of the trailers. There's no point if I know I'll be seeing it anyway, everything is new.

For most films, I'll watch a trailer though.

Well, Lawson isn't sure.

With "The Avengers," a $1 billion box office champion, I do figure that any comics fanboys interested in seeing it already have seen it, given that it opened more than two months ago. If it hasn't left theaters in my area already, it's about to.

With other movies, I can imagine people waiting until they're out on DVD, so maybe waiting a year to openly discuss stuff isn't out of the question.

I dunno exactly where the line should be. It's why I started this thread.

Not long ago, some other fanboys and I were talking about WATCHMEN and we mentioned the big reveal of who the villain actually is, manipulating everything. One of the fanboys let out a howl and complained that he hasn't read WATCHMEN yet but he hoped to shortly, and now we've ruined it. At some point, bless this fellow's heart, you want to say, "Screw you, Sparky, it was published 25 years ago when you already were reading comics, you haven't read it for 25 years, tough turkey."

Anybody who's wants to read work X or see film Y who's bothered about spoilers is well advised not to read threads about X or Y.

If some one does read a thread... no point moaning about spoilers. In general terms don't make life difficult for yourself... don't go out in the rain if getting wet troubles you.

I was discussing the Atlas Shrugged movie with some other people who had seen it. I was in the process of reading the book, but had not finished it yet.

(In case anyone is not aware, the movie only covers the first third of the book, the other two movies are supposedly in the works)

In the process of that conversation, someone spoiled the ending of the book. When I finally finished the book, sure enough, that's exactly what happened. I was appreciative of the other person's summary, however, because knowing the ending allowed me to focus on the way the story was put together rather than being concerned solely with wondering where this was all going. In the particular case of Atlas Shrugged, I would have felt more cheated by experiencing the absurdity of that resolution unwarned.

Oh shit yeah, I totally agree with that, if someone is that stupid to go read a thread about a movie that haven't seen yet, it's their own damn fault.

I thought we were talking about less obvious situations.

Were we?? Doesn't similar logic apply to watching trailers or reading detailed reviews or taking part in conversations about a particular work? (i.e. Just avoid them if spoilers worry you.)

I've not come across any situations so far where if I wanted to avoid knowing detail of a story it was difficult to avoid spoilers: so far nobody has tied me to a chair and related a detailed account of a book I was planning to read.

So you've never been in a casual conversation at work, or a BBQ, or wherever, when someone blurts out a spoiler before you get a chance to duck the conversation? Lucky you. But it happens to some of us every once and a while. Shit happens, not much you can do about it.

I was in a store a few weeks ago when some clerk on the phone loudly talking to a friend gave up a "I can't believe they killed off so and so last night," and I instantly recognized the name and TV show she was referring to.

Even movies do it. There is no warning on "When Harry Met Sally" dvds advising twenty year olds not to watch it if they haven't seen Casablanca yet. Not saying there should be, just pointing out that it's not always so easy to avoid spoilers.

Like allen says, it's not the whole experience, if it's a good book or movie or show whatever you can still enjoy the thing, but spoilers can be annoying. It's bad enough movie trailers give up so much of some movies these days. Before the new The Amazing Spiderman movie came out, some guy had put together a half hour short version of the film from all the available footage from the trailers.

I hadn't seen "The Avengers" on Free Comic Book Day because the movie had only been open a few days then.

So I took Lawson Jr. to two local comics shops to snag some goodies without realizing that EVERY FANBOY WOULD BE JABBERING AT THE TOP OF HIS LUNGS ABOUT EVERYTHING SAID AND DONE IN "THE AVENGERS."

I had to keep zipping away from people to preserve any of the secrecy.

Another pet peeve: Movie reviewers who spoil key plot points or, more frequently, key lines of dialogue.

I'm sure it's difficult to write something about a movie without revealing much of the story. But if there's a death, a switched identity or another plot twist more than 20 minutes into it -- basically, not during the opening credits -- then don't tell me in the friggin' review. I'm not Allen. It actually does hurt my enjoyment of the movie if I'm waiting for the lead actress to get hit by a car and killed halfway through.

Ditto for the key lines, especially the climactic lines in a drama or comedy that the movie takes some time building up to. Don't print it in your review! I'd like to experience the dialogue for the first time when the actors say it, thanks.

Sounds like you've got bigger problems to worry about than movie spoilers.

It must be even more difficult to write something that isn't a totally formulaic and predictable piece of shit, like the Avengers movie.

Yes, but you can nudge odds in your favour. Gut feeling is that majority of people that moan about spoilers have put themselves in "harms way".

But I most likely under-estimate impact of spoilers. I grew up with a cousin who when asked "how was the film" would routinely act it out scene by scene. He trained us all up to mentally tune out of all the fine detail: just let it wash over you, and think about something else.

I still treat reviews in same way. Just see how reviewer rates films (whatever) you've already seen. If he s/he likes similar stuff to you then just check genre and star rating.... don't look at the detail.

I don't doubt there are some drama queens out there who intentionally put themselves in a position to have stuff spoiled, but I'm not so sure it's the majority.

I wish I had that superpower every time my in-laws start talking politics.

That's another one of those obvious ones for me. If you are supposedly trying to avoid spoilers and you read a review you were kind of asking for it. I agree with Lawson on this one, it's not so easy to find a spoiler free review. They often give up something. Best just to stay away if you are avoiding spoilers.

Har!

Wise-ass.

It could be perfectly healthy. Depends on the actress.