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#9700 - 11/10/04 07:49 PM Re: [Hype] New John Byrne Column @ UGO: "Those Wacky Superheroes"
necrotechno Offline
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Registered: 12/02/03
Posts: 3058
Like John Byrne, I haven't seen The Incredibles yet, either. I always wait for the DVD now. But I did roll my eyes at the guy trying to get into his costume, wondering if this merely coincidence or if it was another "homage" to Bob Mayer's Superfolks.

I wasn't too impressed with The Iron Giant, and I still don't understand how the malevolence of that movie could be equated with a Superman story. Oh, yeah... and "metropoli" isn't a word, Mr. Byrne.
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#9701 - 11/10/04 10:57 PM Re: [Hype] New John Byrne Column @ UGO: "Those Wacky Superheroes"
James Van Hise Offline
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Registered: 02/14/02
Posts: 265
Loc: Yucca Valley, CA
[I always wait for the DVD now.]

The only problem with that is that unless you have the biggest screen TV system available (which run ten grand even if you get one cheap), seeing it on DVD is about 20% of what it's like seeing it in a theater on a big screen. With some films it doesn't matter. With THE INCREDIBLES you'll be missing a lot of the impact. While not all films are made to take advantage of the big screen, THE INCREDIBLES certainly does. The visuals are very detailed and will lose a lot on the small screen, and if you opt for the full screen rather than wide screen version, than a third of the image is lost, while the wide screen version is a little small on most TV screens. Plus the sound system in a good theater is way better then on a TV. I have the DIE HARD DVD (the first film, not the sequels) and I've never yet been able to enjoy it from an audio POV like I did when seeing it in the theater where the sound in the film was pretty much an additional character lost in the home video versions. THE INCREDIBLES is just amazing on the big screen.
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#9702 - 11/11/04 01:22 AM Re: [Hype] New John Byrne Column @ UGO: "Those Wacky Superheroes"
Andrew Farago Offline
Member

Registered: 12/01/01
Posts: 377
Loc: San Francisco, CA
I think you may have missed my point with the lists -- but anyway, consider this: TRUE BRIT was produced by 4 people, basically, 3 of whom are current or lapsed Brits themselves. "The Incredibles" was not produced by superheroes, or anyone who makes a living chronicling the adventures of superheroes.

Unless Brad Bird and the employees of Pixar got together and donated all of their free time to making The Incredibles since 2002 or so, I'd say that they qualify as people who make a living chronicling the adventures of superheroes. And if Iron Giant really is a great Superman-style film, as Byrne says, then Bird's been getting paid to chronicle the adventures of superheroes since the mid-1990s.

As to the claim that none of the folks at Pixar are, in fact, superheroes, I'd like to point out that John Lasseter always seems to disappear when there's trouble, only to have the Blue Beetle show up and save the day.
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#9703 - 11/11/04 01:31 PM Re: [Hype] New John Byrne Column @ UGO: "Those Wacky Superheroes"
gene phillips Offline
Member

Registered: 09/30/99
Posts: 5910
Loc: Houston, TX
Quote:
Originally posted by Charles Reece:
I think there's some correct thoughts buried in what Byrne says. I'd like to see something more serous done with CG, rather than that ugly looking caricatural realism aimed at preteens. But if some form of realism has to be used and it's a superhero film, why not play it straight, like most superhero comics are written? How many lame CG films for kids with some satirical winks "for adults" can people possibly take? Evidently more than I. This isn't to say Byrne's hillbilly defensiveness over some backwater genre isn't an embarrassment (at least for those considering themselves fans); he's the butt of everyone's jokes, fanboy and non-fanboy alike. However, Hollywood always has to make the most meaningless changes in superheroes for no good reason other than, I suspect, to feel creatively involved on what's not much more than a long commercial for some marketing tie-ins (take the first Spidey film: why not have Gwen, so Raimi could kill her for dramatic reasons, but that would've fucked up the commercial needs of constantly advertising the same characters in every movie).


Re: meaningless changes--

Kindly show me a medium, or even a genre, from which Hollywood has adapted works and has always kept said works exactly like the original versions. The practice of making meaningless changes, changes that serve no purpose save putting the moviemakers' creative stamp on the product, is nothing new, and has nothing to do with translating the dynamic of superheroes to film.

And the idea that SPIDER-MAN 1, whatever its failings, is no more than "a long commercial for some merchandising tie-ins" is banal beyond belief. One could as easily call a Woody Allen film a long commercial for filmgoers to buy into the cult of the Woodman, and one would be saying about as much.

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#9704 - 11/11/04 04:15 PM Re: [Hype] New John Byrne Column @ UGO: "Those Wacky Superheroes"
necrotechno Offline
Member

Registered: 12/02/03
Posts: 3058
Quote:
Originally posted by James Van Hise:
THE INCREDIBLES is just amazing on the big screen.

I don't doubt it. But I didn't stop going to the theaters over the quality of the sound, size of the picture, or even the price of the popcorn. I just like having my remote control. Spider-Man was the last picture I saw in the theater, and I reeeaaaallly wanted a rewind button for the rain scene. laugh Movies like Almost Famous and Moulin Rouge made me wish I had a fast-forward button...
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#9705 - 11/12/04 04:23 PM Re: [Hype] New John Byrne Column @ UGO: "Those Wacky Superheroes"
Erik Larsen Offline
Member

Registered: 03/25/02
Posts: 1795
Loc: Oakland, CA
Quote:
Originally posted by Charles Reece:
I think there's some correct thoughts buried in what Byrne says. I'd like to see something more serous done with CG, rather than that ugly looking caricatural realism aimed at preteens. But if some form of realism has to be used and it's a superhero film, why not play it straight, like most superhero comics are written? How many lame CG films for kids with some satirical winks "for adults" can people possibly take?


As far as I've been able to tell--CGI just isn't GOOD ENOUGH yet to DO a serious job. When they DO go for real--it looks fake--it looks stupid--it looks wrong. Given that the BEST they can do is cartoony--I don't see anything wrong with doing a cartoon.

I'm sure that at some point--somebody WILL do a CGI superhero straight--and it will tank and we can go back to seeing CGI cartoons that are fun to look at again.

I think realism is best suited for live action--and most of those HAVE been played straight. Those that haven't been--generally do poorly. When Batman movies got campy--people stopped going to them. People didn't line up to see the Mystery Men or Meteor Man.

But at the end of the day--IT'S THEIR MOVIE! And if THEY want to do what THEY want to with THEIR characters--that's THEIR business! It's not like they did a campy Fantastic Four movie--they made up their OWN CHARACTERS!

Sheesh.

You wanna do a straight superhero movie--go make one of your own.
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#9706 - 11/12/04 05:31 PM Re: [Hype] New John Byrne Column @ UGO: "Those Wacky Superheroes"
IPreache.r. Offline
Member

Registered: 06/13/03
Posts: 37
Go see Ghost in the Shell 2 in theaters right now. Nice 35mm print.

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#9707 - 11/12/04 10:30 PM Re: [Hype] New John Byrne Column @ UGO: "Those Wacky Superheroes"
jwyatt Offline
Member

Registered: 12/18/01
Posts: 1259
Loc: San Francisco, CA USA
Quote:
Originally posted by Erik Larsen:

But at the end of the day--IT'S THEIR MOVIE! And if THEY want to do what THEY want to with THEIR characters--that's THEIR business! It's not like they did a campy Fantastic Four movie--they made up their OWN CHARACTERS!

Sheesh.

You wanna do a straight superhero movie--go make one of your own.


Ah, but John "The Idiot" Byrne thinks he alone 'knows' what super-heroes and their stories *should* be like.

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#9708 - 11/13/04 04:53 AM Re: [Hype] New John Byrne Column @ UGO: "Those Wacky Superheroes"
necrotechno Offline
Member

Registered: 12/02/03
Posts: 3058
To top it off... he's bagging on bad movies (that he hasn't seen), then in the same sentence cops a quote from 2010. Yeesh.
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#9709 - 11/13/04 07:48 AM Re: [Hype] New John Byrne Column @ UGO: "Those Wacky Superheroes"
jack Offline
Member

Registered: 11/11/99
Posts: 12596
Loc: Just south of NYC
for the record, hypocricy is with an "I", whoever uses that word with an "a" is just guessing, and a fucking moron.

Look, I like you guys and all, but this isn't the Byrne board. if you can't criticize him where he is, and whine about his minutae endlessly over here, then he's won.

What's even more interesting is seeing artist's like David and Larsen pile in. You guys have a professional beef with Byrne, or is it now "mob mentality"?

You are the same "folks" that criticize me for my flame wars and "inappropriate behavior", I wish you'd all stop being such "hypocrates".

If you can't criticize him on his turf, then shut the fuck up, most of the rest of us could care less.

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